UVU and the Big West Syndrome

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UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by SoCalAggie » June 4th, 2011, 4:42 pm

Why UVU will never be a major player in the college sports world, even in college sports crazy Utah, is quite evident; I call it the Big West syndrome or "BWS".

Prime examples of schools with BWS are Cal State Northridge, Fullerton, Long Beach, and to some extent, San Jose State (et al). These are school with huge student populations in large metropolitan areas. Yet they are lucky to get 1,300 fans to show up to their marquee sporting event, usually Basketball. Why is that? Well it's simple really; they lack any meaningful student involvement, rich alumni willing to give to the program, and most importantly, it's how they function. These are commuter schools full of students who attend out of convenience, proximity to home town, employment centers, mass transit, and other amenities. These are not destination schools, these are schools who's primary objective it is to serve the communities they are located in, and the surrounding areas.

Enter UVU. They fit the bill of a typical Big West school, they have a large student population, they serve a large and growing metropolitan area, the are close to mass transit (well, next to the 1-15 anyway), and they are not, per se, a destination school. At one time UVU had a large California student population of kids who's parents wanted them to live the zoobie lifestyle, but they could not get into byu. Those days, I think, are gone. Thus UVU's BWS problem.

Sure these schools have a handful of passionate fans, but they are not and never will be UCLA's, SC's BYU'S or even a U of U. UVU has it worse IMHO. They are a very young school with no storied past of championships and tourney appearances. They don't have any rich alum wiling to put any major support into the schools sports program. They recently tried, and failed to sell the naming rights to their own gymnasium (remember the David O. Mckay center?).

They might be an up and coming college, but they don't have any history, they don't have a large spread out traditional style college campus with an Old Main type of setting on a hill somewhere. It's a concrete structure next to the freeway that more resembles a High School than a University. They have no room for expansion, there is no chance of an on-campus football stadium, and there is little room for growth. This will always make for a disjointed college campus, with satellite campuses spread out through Happy Valley.

In other words, UVU has no future as a WAC or MWC type of conference. They're best bet is a Big West. They don't even fit into the mold of a Big Sky school since they don't and will probably never have football. Face it UVU fans, you go to a glorified JC. Sure you are proud of your education, maybe it's a good education. You could say the same about any of the Big West schools, no one is knocking a degree from Northridge or Fullerton, that's for sure. All I'm saying is that you are not USU, you are not Utah, you are definitely not byu (because it's a private religious school and UVU, much to the dismay of some, is a public secular school). But hey, strive to the best Big West type of school there is! Go Wolverines... oh and quitchurebitching about USU blocking you out of the WAC. It's not just us... were just not that intoya.


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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by ProvoAggie » June 4th, 2011, 6:34 pm

I agree that their best bet and I hope they eventually get in there. On a side note, they didn't have any problem selling the naming rights to what is now the UCCU (Utah Community Credit Union) center. They got a pretty good deal out of it.



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by LKGates » June 4th, 2011, 7:09 pm

I was thinking about how UVU's president opined that the reason we were "blocking" them from the WAC was because we didn't want to compete with them for athletes. Then I started thinking about their problem with being a landlocked campus. Suddenly, I had a flash of inspiration. UVU needs to open an extension campus. In fact, I think that they should open one right in Logan, where they can go toe-to-toe with USU. It would be a bold move. They could call it the Utah Valley University Logan Annex, or "the UVULA" for short.

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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by redburnday » June 4th, 2011, 10:40 pm

On the subject of athletes, when was the last time we had a regular starter in the NBA? I would kill to have a Ronnie Price type player.



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by slcagg » June 5th, 2011, 9:37 am

When was the last time Ronnie Price was a regular starter in the NBA? In fact tell me the last time Ronnie Price started?



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by redburnday » June 5th, 2011, 6:31 pm

That's even worse! I guess I would kill to have an Aggie player in the NBA then...



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by Imakeitrain » June 6th, 2011, 10:26 am

I heard (from a mission comp. whose sister was friends with his wife... so not overly reliable) that Ryan Toolson had wanted to transfer from UVU to USU... but UVU had denied that. We may not have had NBA talent... But that would have been a REALLY good Aggie team...


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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by ProvoAggie » June 6th, 2011, 10:29 am

Could UVU have really stopped him from transferring to USU if he wanted to? Wouldn't he have just lost a year of eligibility?



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by SoCalAggie » June 6th, 2011, 12:18 pm

ProvoAggie wrote:Could UVU have really stopped him from transferring to USU if he wanted to? Wouldn't he have just lost a year of eligibility?
Correct, there is no way they could have stopped him, but he probably asked for a release, in which case he could have played w/o sitting out. He can still leave on his own accord, but he would have to sit out a year. He probably doesn't want to pay for a whole year of school on his own, and I don't think USU is going to burn a scholy just to have a dude sit around for a year. That's my guess anyway... if indeed the guy did want to transfer. I don't blame UVU or anyone for not granting a release to someone after they've invested money and time.


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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by ProvoAggie » June 6th, 2011, 12:24 pm

I don't blame UVU for that one either. I don't know of any schools that would grant a release to a player because they'd rather play somewhere else...especially when that somewhere else is an in state school that you currently have on your schedule.



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by AgSpaceCase » June 6th, 2011, 1:01 pm

Getting a release from the school doesn't allow a player to play immediately. The one year is required for transfers within the same level regardless of gaining release or not. Getting the release from the previous school is required to open up recruiting again, he can't be contacted if he is not released and still in school. He also can't get an athletic scholarship from another school until their rights have expired (one year).

A player has to be pretty serious about transferring to risk losing so much. Since you signed a contract with the school and the school has to let you out or go a full year before you sign a contract with another school. The school makes large investments into their players and don't like to see the few that provide good returns (like Toolson) not be loyal.

I wish that the school couldn't break the LOI contract so much easier than the players can or that there could be exceptions on the year for players who get screwed by coaching changes and the like but the system does work pretty well.


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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by TheRoar » June 7th, 2011, 11:27 am

Pretty good analysis, SoCal. Except, I thought they did in fact sell the naming rights to the McKay Center (or did it fall through?).

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=12217953



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by ProvoAggie » June 7th, 2011, 11:58 am

TheRoar wrote:Pretty good analysis, SoCal. Except, I thought they did in fact sell the naming rights to the McKay Center (or did it fall through?).

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=12217953
I mentioned it up above. It did go through and the side of the building as well as the basketball court says UCCU Center. It didn't take long to sell the naming rights there either.



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by AGinNEIowa » June 7th, 2011, 1:40 pm

what's UVU's athletic Budget? is it anywhere near WAC level?


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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by 88USUAggie » June 7th, 2011, 2:07 pm

Throw Portland State in that bucket of Big West profile schools as well...big student population, big population center, and no support or budget - in the shadow of huge programs.

PSU has no interest or ability to move up from BSky.



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Re: UVU and the Big West Syndrome

Post by Aglicious » June 7th, 2011, 6:26 pm

What was with Kragthorpe's article today? It's like he couldn't decide which side to take and defend or write about. On one hand the headline makes it sound like not having football is UVU's biggest problem, nothing to do with USU blocking them. Then the article goes on to say how UVU has built "solid programs" and drags USU's name back into the discussion when it says USU administrators "are not backing the Wolverines, but they’re not biased against them."

Again, why even mention USU in this article? If his point is to show that UVU doesn't merit an invite or doesn't fit the WAC's needs, then leave it at that! Kragthorpe even goes as far as to say that if the WAC invites someone like Seattle or CS-Bakersfield as a basketball school only, then he will criticize USU. Why do any of these media members continue to think we should be fighting UVU's battles for them? What am I missing? What does UVU bring to the WAC? :headscratch: :noidea:



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