What if I told you Craig Smith

Aggie formerly in Hawaii · Post by **Aggie formerly in Hawaii** » March 28th, 2021, 10:48 am

coolag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 10:20 am
Okay fine we are whiners but hope Craig Smith makes Utah a winner? Come on now. That's just screams not a true aggie.

Yep that is what I see as nonsense. Craig Smith did a great job at USU, but why the hell would I wish for him to have any success at Utah? It is totally his right to coach anywhere he wants, but he chose Utah which shows he doesn't care about USU. If he did care, he wouldn't have gone to a place many Aggie fans despise and one that has zero respect for USU.

And I have no problem with him chasing the money that is normal, but coaches also pick their spots. Mid major coaches turn down higher paying jobs all the time for other higher paying jobs. He easily could have turned down Utah, had another successful year and taken the Kansas State job or whatever P5 midwest job opens up next year.

Pacobag · Post by **Pacobag** » March 28th, 2021, 2:01 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 10:48 am

coolag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 10:20 am
Okay fine we are whiners but hope Craig Smith makes Utah a winner? Come on now. That's just screams not a true aggie.
Yep that is what I see as nonsense. Craig Smith did a great job at USU, but why the hell would I wish for him to have any success at Utah? It is totally his right to coach anywhere he wants, but he chose Utah which shows he doesn't care about USU. If he did care, he wouldn't have gone to a place many Aggie fans despise and one that has zero respect for USU.

And I have no problem with him chasing the money that is normal, but coaches also pick their spots. Mid major coaches turn down higher paying jobs all the time for other higher paying jobs. He easily could have turned down Utah, had another successful year and taken the Kansas State job or whatever P5 midwest job opens up next year.

Accepting an offer from Utah shows he doesn’t care about USU? It is a business decision. Sports isn’t a war between good and evil where actual lives are being lost. Sports is just entertainment and a chance to step away from real problems once in awhile.

If you want to wish Craig Smith, his future staff, and the young men who choose to play for Craig utter failure because they are wearing red, go for it.

I’m in the camp that believes we will be worse next season with the loss of Queta and AA. There is no guarantee that Smith would eventually get an offer as good as the one from Utah. He struck while the iron was hot.

scotlandog · Post by **scotlandog** » March 28th, 2021, 2:43 pm

The reaction on social media from Ute fans shows they would agree somewhat with this sentiment. They are not happy and not excited. Honestly, I think they will be happy with what they’ve got after the players buy in.

Obviously, Smith had great success at USU over the last 3 seasons. No one was calling for his firing. I think we are set for a rebuilding year and next years results would almost certainly be less than the last 3 years in terms of success even if Smith had stayed.

There is obviously a lot of truth to the statement that without Sam and Queta, Smiths success may be a much different story. For me, I think it’s fair to say that Smith performed above what was expected and likewise he underperformed with respect to how we utilized Queta. I think he utilized Sam very well. I think Smith knows how to utilize and facilitate guards into his scheme better than he did centers. I think that’s a fair take if one would want to make it.

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AggieFBObsession · Post by **AggieFBObsession** » March 28th, 2021, 2:53 pm

Pacobag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 2:01 pm
Accepting an offer from Utah shows he doesn’t care about USU? It is a business decision. Sports isn’t a war between good and evil where actual lives are being lost. Sports is just entertainment and a chance to step away from real problems once in awhile.

I’m in the camp that believes we will be worse next season with the loss of Queta and AA. There is no guarantee that Smith would eventually get an offer as good as the one from Utah. He struck while the iron was hot.

The reason that I'm replying to your posts is that you seems to give coaches the pass for just chasing the cash as if that's the only thing that mattered.

Utah State gave him an opportunity to elevate his profile as a coach and have success. He chose to sign a contract with one of the two schools that on a regular basis undercut Utah State's athletic programs. And he knows they undercut Utah State too based on the scheduling issue. He had no consideration for the athletic program or for the student athletes when he made this decision. His only motivation here was to make more money and stay in Utah. Utah State was not part of his consideration at all or he would've handled it differently.

Furthermore, regarding a different reply from you, there were several reports where he had promised the players that he wasn't leaving. Again, he's dishonest and inconsiderate of everyone else but himself and probably his family.

He's a good basketball coach, but I've lost all respect for him. He could've handled things much differently. If he wanted to chase money, he could've just as easily signed at another school. If he wanted to stay in Utah he could've just as easily stayed at Utah State where he was making only 1 million which I'm certain is clearly not enough for him and his family to live on. Right?

What he didn't do is more telling than what he did do.

Aggie84025 · Post by **Aggie84025** » March 28th, 2021, 3:26 pm

AggieFBObsession wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 2:53 pm

Pacobag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 2:01 pm
Accepting an offer from Utah shows he doesn’t care about USU? It is a business decision. Sports isn’t a war between good and evil where actual lives are being lost. Sports is just entertainment and a chance to step away from real problems once in awhile.

I’m in the camp that believes we will be worse next season with the loss of Queta and AA. There is no guarantee that Smith would eventually get an offer as good as the one from Utah. He struck while the iron was hot.
The reason that I'm replying to your posts is that you seems to give coaches the pass for just chasing the cash as if that's the only thing that mattered.

Utah State gave him an opportunity to elevate his profile as a coach and have success. He chose to sign a contract with one of the two schools that on a regular basis undercut Utah State's athletic programs. And he knows they undercut Utah State too based on the scheduling issue. He had no consideration for the athletic program or for the student athletes when he made this decision. His only motivation here was to make more money and stay in Utah. Utah State was not part of his consideration at all or he would've handled it differently.

Furthermore, regarding a different reply from you, there were several reports where he had promised the players that he wasn't leaving. Again, he's dishonest and inconsiderate of everyone else but himself and probably his family.
poyou are spot one's a good basketball coach, but I've lost all respect for him. He could've handled things much differently. If he wanted to chase money, he could've just as easily signed at another school. If he wanted to stay in Utah he could've just as easily stayed at Utah State where he was making only 1 million which I'm certain is clearly not enough for him and his family to live on. Right?

What he didn't do is more telling than what he did do.

You are spot on

Aggie formerly in Hawaii · Post by **Aggie formerly in Hawaii** » March 28th, 2021, 3:54 pm

Pacobag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 2:01 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 10:48 am

coolag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 10:20 am
Okay fine we are whiners but hope Craig Smith makes Utah a winner? Come on now. That's just screams not a true aggie.
Yep that is what I see as nonsense. Craig Smith did a great job at USU, but why the hell would I wish for him to have any success at Utah? It is totally his right to coach anywhere he wants, but he chose Utah which shows he doesn't care about USU. If he did care, he wouldn't have gone to a place many Aggie fans despise and one that has zero respect for USU.

And I have no problem with him chasing the money that is normal, but coaches also pick their spots. Mid major coaches turn down higher paying jobs all the time for other higher paying jobs. He easily could have turned down Utah, had another successful year and taken the Kansas State job or whatever P5 midwest job opens up next year.
Accepting an offer from Utah shows he doesn’t care about USU? It is a business decision. Sports isn’t a war between good and evil where actual lives are being lost. Sports is just entertainment and a chance to step away from real problems once in awhile.

If you want to wish Craig Smith, his future staff, and the young men who choose to play for Craig utter failure because they are wearing red, go for it.

I’m in the camp that believes we will be worse next season with the loss of Queta and AA. There is no guarantee that Smith would eventually get an offer as good as the one from Utah. He struck while the iron was hot.

I'm in that camp too. Next season it will be a step back, but at the same time coaches don't always leave after their best season. Coaches are judged on their overall body of work and if Smith overachieved with the group next year he still would have been in demand. Shaka Smart didn't leave VCU to Texas after their final four run. He left after a first round exit. Brad Stevens didn't leave for Boston after their final four seasons, he left after a more inferior year.

As for wishing Craig Smith, his staff and the Utah players failure? You are damn right I will just as I always wish Utah failure. Sports are just entertainment. As part of that entertainment, we have rivalries who we celebrate when they lose. I've been very entertained that Utah has been terrible and hope they continue to be so.

Pacobag · Post by **Pacobag** » March 28th, 2021, 3:56 pm

It’s just my view and opinion and many may not share it.

I’m giving him a pass on HIS decided career move. It’s his life and he can place priority on whatever factors he wishes. I don’t know if the decision was easy or hard for him. I don’t know if he only cares about himself or if he also cares about the young men that he was coaching.

I don’t know what information he had when he reportedly spoke to the players about staying and I don’t know exactly what he said.

I’m not close enough to the situation and facts to fairly grade his handling/mishandling of the move. Some were going to feel resentful or betrayed regardless.

Pacobag · Post by **Pacobag** » March 28th, 2021, 4:06 pm

Aggie formerly in Hawaii wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 3:54 pm
I'm in that camp too. Next season it will be a step back, but at the same time coaches don't always leave after their best season. Coaches are judged on their overall body of work and if Smith overachieved with the group next year he still would have been in demand. Shaka Smart didn't leave VCU to Texas after their final four run. He left after a first round exit. Brad Stevens didn't leave for Boston after their final four seasons, he left after a more inferior year.

Those are great examples. I don’t know how many examples there are of coaches who decided to hold out for a better opportunity who ended up regretting it later.

Post by **treesap32** » March 29th, 2021, 10:51 am

AggieFBObsession wrote:
Pacobag wrote: ↑
March 28th, 2021, 2:01 pm
Accepting an offer from Utah shows he doesn’t care about USU? It is a business decision. Sports isn’t a war between good and evil where actual lives are being lost. Sports is just entertainment and a chance to step away from real problems once in awhile.

I’m in the camp that believes we will be worse next season with the loss of Queta and AA. There is no guarantee that Smith would eventually get an offer as good as the one from Utah. He struck while the iron was hot.
The reason that I'm replying to your posts is that you seems to give coaches the pass for just chasing the cash as if that's the only thing that mattered.

Utah State gave him an opportunity to elevate his profile as a coach and have success. He chose to sign a contract with one of the two schools that on a regular basis undercut Utah State's athletic programs. And he knows they undercut Utah State too based on the scheduling issue. He had no consideration for the athletic program or for the student athletes when he made this decision. His only motivation here was to make more money and stay in Utah. Utah State was not part of his consideration at all or he would've handled it differently.

Furthermore, regarding a different reply from you, there were several reports where he had promised the players that he wasn't leaving. Again, he's dishonest and inconsiderate of everyone else but himself and probably his family.

He's a good basketball coach, but I've lost all respect for him. He could've handled things much differently. If he wanted to chase money, he could've just as easily signed at another school. If he wanted to stay in Utah he could've just as easily stayed at Utah State where he was making only 1 million which I'm certain is clearly not enough for him and his family to live on. Right?

What he didn't do is more telling than what he did do.

It's a business and he made a business decision. He just got a higher profile job for quadruple the pay with a guarantee of $18m even if he fails and is fired. I'm not mad at him. I'm grateful for what he did for USU. He was one of the best coaches we've ever had.

I understand how people are upset though. That's fine and expected, especially when he transferred to a rival.

As far as not notifying the players, I'm guessing that negotiations picked up steam until finally Smith couldn't refuse the offer. $18m over six years guaranteed is a tremendous good deal. I'm guessing they started negotiations much lower than that and Smith didn't expect to leave when he talked to the players.

Utah couldn't have a third coach publicly turn then down. Smith being the top candidate was already public. He had all the leverage and apparently used it to his advantage.

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NVAggie · Post by **NVAggie** » March 29th, 2021, 11:33 am

I understand why he left. $$$$$$$$$. I won't wish him well or cheer him on. He has fully embraced they Utah mentality towards Utah State. We will take our $1.3 M and go find a new coach. We need someone who can bring in some talent right away. We have a major rebuild on our hands. I honestly think Craig would have struggled to make it happen next year.

Roy McAvoy · Post by **Roy McAvoy** » April 19th, 2021, 2:56 pm

A few funny updates on things with Coach Smith. Here's a comment from their message board about how it's going so far:

Let's look at who Craig has brought in so far: two coaches and some staffers that have all worked with him before, Worster who played for him at USU, Jenkins who played for Slocum at UNLV and Madsen. I don't know what, if any, connection there was between Smith and Madsen but so far he might be the one outlier--someone who Smith actually brought in without prior history. I just don't know that this is the way to build a winning culture. It may build a positive culture, but I don't know that you can be so closed off to anyone you don't already know and have success at this level.....

.....I'm ready to hear less about culture and more about talent. I get the importance of culture. I really do. But if Smith is going to stick with this approach of only working with his previous inner circle then I don't know what to think. If he isn't in the NCAA in three years then nobody will care about how tight all of the coaches and players are

And then there's this tweet on his most recent hirings. If he hires Austin Hansen as his 3rd assistant I think there's going to be a meltdown. Fans really wanted Chris Burgess or someone who's a known good recruiter.

ineptimusprime · Post by **ineptimusprime** » April 19th, 2021, 3:00 pm

Roy McAvoy wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 2:56 pm
A few funny updates on things with Coach Smith. Here's a comment from their message board about how it's going so far:

Let's look at who Craig has brought in so far: two coaches and some staffers that have all worked with him before, Worster who played for him at USU, Jenkins who played for Slocum at UNLV and Madsen. I don't know what, if any, connection there was between Smith and Madsen but so far he might be the one outlier--someone who Smith actually brought in without prior history. I just don't know that this is the way to build a winning culture. It may build a positive culture, but I don't know that you can be so closed off to anyone you don't already know and have success at this level.....

.....I'm ready to hear less about culture and more about talent. I get the importance of culture. I really do. But if Smith is going to stick with this approach of only working with his previous inner circle then I don't know what to think. If he isn't in the NCAA in three years then nobody will care about how tight all of the coaches and players are
And then there's this tweet on his most recent hirings. If he hires Austin Hansen as his 3rd assistant I think there's going to be a meltdown. Fans really wanted Chris Burgess or someone who's a known good recruiter.

Sounds about white.

WAAggie · Post by **WAAggie** » April 19th, 2021, 3:09 pm

Sounds like some on here about skin color!!!

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Aggie in Boise · Post by **Aggie in Boise** » April 19th, 2021, 3:37 pm

I'm just glad that Craig took the strength coach with him. That dude (Ogden) wasn't effective at all. The strength training program went downhill when Alan Bishop left.

ineptimusprime · Post by **ineptimusprime** » April 19th, 2021, 3:43 pm

Aggie in Boise wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 3:37 pm
I'm just glad that Craig took the strength coach with him. That dude (Ogden) wasn't effective at all. The strength training program went downhill when Alan Bishop left.

What are you talking about? I mean, have you seen the transformation of Liam McChesney?

Aggie in Boise · Post by **Aggie in Boise** » April 19th, 2021, 3:47 pm

ineptimusprime wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 3:43 pm

Aggie in Boise wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 3:37 pm
I'm just glad that Craig took the strength coach with him. That dude (Ogden) wasn't effective at all. The strength training program went downhill when Alan Bishop left.
What are you talking about? I mean, have you seen the transformation of Liam McChesney?

LoL. Do you have the body transformation pics?

Post by **Aglicious** » April 19th, 2021, 4:18 pm

Aggie in Boise wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 3:47 pm

ineptimusprime wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 3:43 pm

Aggie in Boise wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 3:37 pm
I'm just glad that Craig took the strength coach with him. That dude (Ogden) wasn't effective at all. The strength training program went downhill when Alan Bishop left.
What are you talking about? I mean, have you seen the transformation of Liam McChesney?
LoL. Do you have the body transformation pics?

Word is he was posing for his "after" shots of his massive thighs when the flash from the camera cracked 3 of his ribs. Poor guy.

mcaggie1 · Post by **mcaggie1** » April 19th, 2021, 4:28 pm

DCAggie24 wrote: ↑
March 27th, 2021, 6:30 pm
How much of Craig Smiths lack of recruiting was more on kids not wanting to come to Logan, UT. What if the staff as a whole connected with kids that were interested in the program but ultimately didn’t want to spend the best 4ish years of their lives in Logan? This is a genuine question. Coming off those last two seasons prior to this last one and the USU brand was probably at its height in recent memory. Maybe a top 20 ranking for a few minutes, back to back MWC Championships, two Tourney bids etc doesn’t help the brand enough to generate more interest. Or maybe Craig was that bad of a recruiter that even with all that he came away with not that much.(that we can tell).
We all revere USU, The Spectrum, and generally Cache Valley as a whole but it seems like USU had to find the players like Bean, who slip through the cracks a bit. Maybe I’m wrong but I don’t see recruits lining up to come play in Logan if they have other options in warmer, larger destinations(generalization). Could another coach do a better job at convincing those higher recruited kids with options?? I guess we will find out.

Poppycock!

A. He was a good coach for us
B. His players loved him and some followed him to U.
C. Laramie Wy, Lubbock Tx, Ft Collins Co, and a bunch more college towns are not exactly desirable metropolitan areas to recruit to.
D. Quetta, Roberts, Williams, Halimon, Green, Rolle, Rock, Peniger, Santos, Moore, Jackson.......Wagner, Love, Turbin, King, Shivers, Taylor, Lane, Adams and Chuckie , and many more all came from bigger places, much bigger places..and they loved Logan and the beauty of the place.
The only people that say you can’t get quality young men to come to Logan are the ones who don’t believe you can.

Agezzz · Post by **Agezzz** » April 22nd, 2021, 11:59 am

mcaggie1 wrote: ↑
April 19th, 2021, 4:28 pm

DCAggie24 wrote: ↑
March 27th, 2021, 6:30 pm
How much of Craig Smiths lack of recruiting was more on kids not wanting to come to Logan, UT. What if the staff as a whole connected with kids that were interested in the program but ultimately didn’t want to spend the best 4ish years of their lives in Logan? This is a genuine question. Coming off those last two seasons prior to this last one and the USU brand was probably at its height in recent memory. Maybe a top 20 ranking for a few minutes, back to back MWC Championships, two Tourney bids etc doesn’t help the brand enough to generate more interest. Or maybe Craig was that bad of a recruiter that even with all that he came away with not that much.(that we can tell).
We all revere USU, The Spectrum, and generally Cache Valley as a whole but it seems like USU had to find the players like Bean, who slip through the cracks a bit. Maybe I’m wrong but I don’t see recruits lining up to come play in Logan if they have other options in warmer, larger destinations(generalization). Could another coach do a better job at convincing those higher recruited kids with options?? I guess we will find out.
Poppycock!

A. He was a good coach for us
B. His players loved him and some followed him to U.
C. Laramie Wy, Lubbock Tx, Ft Collins Co, and a bunch more college towns are not exactly desirable metropolitan areas to recruit to.
D. Quetta, Roberts, Williams, Halimon, Green, Rolle, Rock, Peniger, Santos, Moore, Jackson.......Wagner, Love, Turbin, King, Shivers, Taylor, Lane, Adams and Chuckie , and many more all came from bigger places, much bigger places..and they loved Logan and the beauty of the place.
The only people that say you can’t get quality young men to come to Logan are the ones who don’t believe you can.

To say that Logan does not have cultural issues with some recruits would not be honest. LDS kids understand it, while many non LDS would not. Salt Lake is a very different experience for non LDS kids than Logan. A HUGE difference. I don't have an answer as to why USU of late, seems to have so few players of color and a lot of LDS/returned missionary players. I don't think the answer is simply cold winters or some other lame reason. But I certainly have my opinion. Go Aggies!

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