20 game schedule.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 6:10 pm

According to the San Diego Union-Tribune, MW AD's have recommended a 20 game conference schedule beginning in the 22/23 season. The reason given for the delay was so the conference could finish up the 2 year A10 challenge.

It helps some schools and hurts others..

It doesn't say how the vote went but Alford has said he was not in favor. SDSU, definite no, UNLV, no.

This would seem to indicate the conference will remain at 11 members going forward.

I, personally, think it is a bad idea but I do understand that many here support the idea.

The official vote will be held at a later date but it does appear to just be a formality.

Aggie formerly in Hawaii · Post by **Aggie formerly in Hawaii** » May 18th, 2020, 6:39 pm

Personally I would prefer 18 and 2 more out of conference games. Of course if we are replacing Eastern Oregon and St Katherine I'm all for it. I don't believe those types of games are necessary. Maybe someone with more college basketball knowledge can enlighten me, but I imagine the team would get better competition and experience going at each other in a scrimmage than playing those games.

SLB · Post by **SLB** » May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm

I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:30 pm

It may mean that the conference season will start a week earlier than normal. If you can't get D-1 schools to come to your gym, it may mean more games like St Katherine. I don't see how this will make your ooc scheduling any easier.

But..You get 10 home conference games and 10 on the road. That leaves 12 games ooc. Because the conference may start sooner you will have to cram those 12 games into a shorter window.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.

According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..

SLB · Post by **SLB** » May 18th, 2020, 7:34 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.
According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..

Last season, high-major teams were afraid to play us. This is why that we had 2 D2 teams on the 19-20 schedule.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:36 pm

What makes you think they will want to schedule even if you add the extra conference games?

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:36 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:36 pm
What makes you think they will want to schedule you even if you add the extra conference games?

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:37 pm

oops...

Bank Shot · Post by **Bank Shot** » May 18th, 2020, 7:37 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:34 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.
According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..
Last season, high-major teams were afraid to play us. This is why that we had 2 D2 teams on the schedule.

Wasn't part of the late scheduling of NAIA and D2 teams because a couple of the Jamaica tourney teams flaked out?

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:39 pm

This could help by having the schools play 2 conference games on the road and 2 at home the next week. And so on..

SLB · Post by **SLB** » May 18th, 2020, 7:40 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:36 pm
What makes you think they will want to schedule even if you add the extra conference games?

The high-major conferences are doing the same thing to avoid playing good mid-majors. Look at how the scheduling for us goes with Utah, Utah can be trusted in chickening out in football and basketball.

SLB · Post by **SLB** » May 18th, 2020, 7:42 pm

Bank Shot wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:37 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:34 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.
According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..
Last season, high-major teams were afraid to play us. This is why that we had 2 D2 teams on the schedule.
Wasn't part of the late scheduling of NAIA and D2 teams because a couple of the Jamaica tourney teams flaked out?

No, it was D1 teams being chickens.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:48 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:40 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:36 pm
What makes you think they will want to schedule even if you add the extra conference games?
The high-major conferences are doing the same thing to avoid playing good mid-majors. Look at how the scheduling for us goes with Utah, Utah can be trusted in chickening out in football and basketball.

So we should do the same thing to avoid playing good majors..? This was done to help schools have at least one less buy game at home. It was not designed to build ooc resumes. You are still going to have a tough time getting good home games..This doesn't change that.

Bank Shot · Post by **Bank Shot** » May 18th, 2020, 7:51 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:42 pm

Bank Shot wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:37 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:34 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.
According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..
Last season, high-major teams were afraid to play us. This is why that we had 2 D2 teams on the schedule.
Wasn't part of the late scheduling of NAIA and D2 teams because a couple of the Jamaica tourney teams flaked out?
No, it was D1 teams being chickens.

I was referring to the posts made at the time: Here's one that explains it pretty well.

OKAggie wrote: ↑
November 20th, 2019, 8:32 am
A couple of items of note:

Eastern Michigan is one of the four "lower tier" teams in the tournament, along with NCA&T, UMBC and NIcholls State. Each of the lower tier teams was supposed to play two games on the road against the upper tier teams (USU, LSU, Rhode Island, North Texas), then play in a four team bracket in Jamaica this weekend. NCA&T and Nicholls, played their two road games, but Eastern Michigan only played North Texas, and obviously should have also played at USU. (Also, it looks like UMBC only played one upper tier team losing to LSU, and URI only got one lower tier game, beating Nicholls.) I've heard that's one reason why our OOC schedule took so long -- the organizers of the Jamaica Classic tried but failed to get EMU (or maybe UMBC?) to live up to its obligation to play at USU, and by the time that effort concluded most other teams had already filled their OOC dance cards. Thus St. Katherines. (I don't know anything, so please correct me if you do )

EMU also won at North Texas, the only lower tier team to steal a win at the upper tier opponent.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 7:56 pm

Getting the two fill in games you played last year was a fluke because of the tourney mess up. That doesn't happen every year. But if you automatically eliminate two conference games what exactly have you accomplished?

I think what may happen is schools who want to build a post season resume will play fewer ooc games at home. Maybe 8 ooc road and neutral site games and 4 at home. Maybe even 9 on the road.

SLB · Post by **SLB** » May 18th, 2020, 7:58 pm

Bank Shot wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:51 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:42 pm

Bank Shot wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:37 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:34 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.
According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..
Last season, high-major teams were afraid to play us. This is why that we had 2 D2 teams on the schedule.
Wasn't part of the late scheduling of NAIA and D2 teams because a couple of the Jamaica tourney teams flaked out?
No, it was D1 teams being chickens.
I was referring to the posts made at the time: Here's one that explains it pretty well.

OKAggie wrote: ↑
November 20th, 2019, 8:32 am
A couple of items of note:

Eastern Michigan is one of the four "lower tier" teams in the tournament, along with NCA&T, UMBC and NIcholls State. Each of the lower tier teams was supposed to play two games on the road against the upper tier teams (USU, LSU, Rhode Island, North Texas), then play in a four team bracket in Jamaica this weekend. NCA&T and Nicholls, played their two road games, but Eastern Michigan only played North Texas, and obviously should have also played at USU. (Also, it looks like UMBC only played one upper tier team losing to LSU, and URI only got one lower tier game, beating Nicholls.) I've heard that's one reason why our OOC schedule took so long -- the organizers of the Jamaica Classic tried but failed to get EMU (or maybe UMBC?) to live up to its obligation to play at USU, and by the time that effort concluded most other teams had already filled their OOC dance cards. Thus St. Katherines. (I don't know anything, so please correct me if you do )

EMU also won at North Texas, the only lower tier team to steal a win at the upper tier opponent.

There was other teams, and they pulled a second to not play us. I know that it took forever to have a complete schedule.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 8:00 pm

I understand the new 20 game rule will not allow for any non D-1 games other than exhibitions.

Bank Shot · Post by **Bank Shot** » May 18th, 2020, 8:07 pm

Hard to say year in and year out, but last year another game with New Mexico and Nevada would have looked a lot better than St. Kath and EOU. Or EMU and UMBC for that matter.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 8:16 pm

St Kath and EOU didn't count one way or the other.

SLB · Post by **SLB** » May 18th, 2020, 8:20 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 8:16 pm
St Kath and EOU didn't count one way or the other.

In our official W-L, they did count.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 8:24 pm

But not for rating purposes. At any rate in 2 years you won't have the option of adding non D-1 games if you can't get a D-1 home games.

Bank Shot · Post by **Bank Shot** » May 18th, 2020, 8:29 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 8:16 pm
St Kath and EOU didn't count one way or the other.

Exactly. But @ UNR and home against UNM would have. Those two were just black holes in our schedule.

slcagg · Post by **slcagg** » May 18th, 2020, 8:34 pm

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 18th, 2020, 8:39 pm

So will those games against the bottom of the standings in the MW. You had a flukey schedule problem. Maybe that will never happen again but this does not make it any easier for you to get decent D-1 schools to Logan. You may have to really up your payout.

At any rate where this really hurts is UNLV, SDSU and NM have no problem getting high quality home games. They are the schools that raise the profile of the conference. The rest of us benefit from that. Maybe the 20 game schedule really helps the majority of the conference so that is good. It hurts NV which doesn't have much trouble filling the ooc part of the schedule. You have to compromise and take the good with the bad in mid major land, I guess.

dogie · Post by **dogie** » May 18th, 2020, 9:29 pm

Bank Shot wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:51 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:42 pm

Bank Shot wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:37 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:34 pm

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:32 pm

SLB wrote: ↑
May 18th, 2020, 7:29 pm
I saw this trend coming. Big money conference were trying to avoid good mid-majors. Look at LSU, people were looking down at them because they lost to East Tennessee State and us. Florida lost to us, and the same thing happen.
College Basketball wants to be like College Football.
According to the report the MW will be the first mid major to do this. I would be somewhat surprised if any others do it..butyouneverknow..
Last season, high-major teams were afraid to play us. This is why that we had 2 D2 teams on the schedule.
Wasn't part of the late scheduling of NAIA and D2 teams because a couple of the Jamaica tourney teams flaked out?
No, it was D1 teams being chickens.
I was referring to the posts made at the time: Here's one that explains it pretty well.

OKAggie wrote: ↑
November 20th, 2019, 8:32 am
A couple of items of note:

Eastern Michigan is one of the four "lower tier" teams in the tournament, along with NCA&T, UMBC and NIcholls State. Each of the lower tier teams was supposed to play two games on the road against the upper tier teams (USU, LSU, Rhode Island, North Texas), then play in a four team bracket in Jamaica this weekend. NCA&T and Nicholls, played their two road games, but Eastern Michigan only played North Texas, and obviously should have also played at USU. (Also, it looks like UMBC only played one upper tier team losing to LSU, and URI only got one lower tier game, beating Nicholls.) I've heard that's one reason why our OOC schedule took so long -- the organizers of the Jamaica Classic tried but failed to get EMU (or maybe UMBC?) to live up to its obligation to play at USU, and by the time that effort concluded most other teams had already filled their OOC dance cards. Thus St. Katherines. (I don't know anything, so please correct me if you do )

EMU also won at North Texas, the only lower tier team to steal a win at the upper tier opponent.

I blame Jersey Mike’s, and I refuse to frequent their establishments.

Also, the same thing happened years ago when Valparaiso declined playing in Logan as part of the South Padre Island Invitational. The tournament organizers should have imposed strict requirements for the lower tier schools to fulfill their commitment to play the upper tiers rather than issuing an “invitation.” I think Jersey Mike’s might have had something to do with that failure, also.

I’m hoping they rename the next exempt tournament to “Mertyl Beach Compulsory.”

brownjeans · Post by **brownjeans** » May 18th, 2020, 11:33 pm

If the choice is two more conference games vs two OoC games vs majors or good mid-majors from other conferences - I say keep the OoC games.
However, if the choice is two more conference games vs two OoC games vs terrible D1 teams, or non-D1 teams - I'd rather we play the two extra conference games.

Aggie84025 · Post by **Aggie84025** » May 19th, 2020, 7:43 am

I like the 20 game conference schedule. I don't think this will help us get bette OOC games, but it does allow us most years 1 more solid home/away game. Sure the years where it is AF or SJSU that obviously does not help the situation, but more often than not it will.

Take this year for example. We would have played at Nevada which would have a been Q2 game that was bordering a Q1 game for both sides. New Mexico would have been a Q1 for them, but I believe a Q3 for us. Sure other teams can get higher profile teams to their place, but for a lot of the conference that is just not the case.

slcagg · Post by **slcagg** » May 19th, 2020, 7:51 am

I’d rather add 1 more basketball school Gonzaga/nmsu (should have tried to add Wichita state a few years ago) and have two divisions and play 16. Just my opinion.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 19th, 2020, 8:07 am

"Sure other teams can get higher profile teams to their place, but for a lot of the conference that is just not the case."

I think this is at the heart of the reason for going to 20.

slcagg · Post by **slcagg** » May 19th, 2020, 8:25 am

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 19th, 2020, 8:07 am
"Sure other teams can get higher profile teams to their place, but for a lot of the conference that is just not the case."

I think this is at the heart of the reason for going to 20.

Does New Mexico get solid teams to visit the pit?

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 19th, 2020, 8:46 am

I think they do , generally..

Every school in the conference has some cupcakes on their ooc schedule. That will still be the case with the 20 man schedule.

This will hurt schools who can get good games. I am unconvinced it will help the schools who voted for it but what the hey..

The high majors who go to 20 do so to get 2 more top 150 games. When the MW does this it will get 2 games against schools over 250.

Maybe that is all we can get ooc but this just guarantees that will happen.

I would say that the MW is now the 5 best mid major conference behind the AAC, WCC, A10 and the Ivy League.

I don't see how this even slows the descent.

FL350Aggie · Post by **FL350Aggie** » May 19th, 2020, 8:53 am

nvspuds wrote: ↑
May 19th, 2020, 8:46 am
I think they do , generally..

Every school in the conference has some cupcakes on their ooc schedule. That will still be the case with the 20 man schedule.

This will hurt schools who can get good games. I am unconvinced it will help the schools who voted for it but what the hey..

The high majors who go to 20 do so to get 2 more top 150 games. When the MW does this it will get 2 games against schools over 250.

Maybe that is all we can get ooc but this just guarantees that will happen.

I would say that the MW is now the 5 best mid major conference behind the AAC, WCC, A10 and the Ivy League.

I don't see how this even slows the descent.

I would rather see better non conference games. According RPI, the MWC was the 10th best conference this past season. Right behind the WCC. The Ivy League is WAY down there at 15th. If Wyoming, Air Force and SJSU could get their act together the MWC could easily jump the WCC.

nvspuds · Post by **nvspuds** » May 19th, 2020, 9:06 am

The Ivies have finished higher at times over the last few years.

A 20 game schedule doesn't help any school get their "act" together.

The 20 game vote is to level the ooc schedule playing field for conference members. It is designed to make things fair.

It hurts the schools who can get better ooc schedules.

While I am unconvinced it will help the schools who voted for it, I am often wrong. Maybe it will lift all boats and not be divisive. Let's hope for that.

NVAggie · Post by **NVAggie** » May 19th, 2020, 9:24 am

It won't help those struggling to get better games. It also won't hinder those who get better games to still get those games. It is all about what each school decides to replace. I don't think it will have a huge effect one way or the other.

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