Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Sl7vk » February 20th, 2020, 8:19 pm

aggieguy13 wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 7:50 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 6:28 pm
aggieguy13 wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 4:38 pm
Just to give some further context as to what we're watching: There are 122 D-1 players who have shot 166 or more threes this season. (Miller is at 182 attempts.) Out of those 122, Miller ranks 121st in 3PT percentage.

The good news is that he would have to miss his next 25 attempts to overtake last place, so he's got that going for him.
So who’s worse than miller? I’m on the edge of my seat!
Caleb Hunter, 5'11" freshman guard from Mississippi Valley State is shooting an astounding 53/206 (25.7%) from 3 this season.
And they are 2-23 currently.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Real Life Aggie » February 20th, 2020, 9:00 pm

aggieguy13 wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 7:50 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 6:28 pm
aggieguy13 wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 4:38 pm
Just to give some further context as to what we're watching: There are 122 D-1 players who have shot 166 or more threes this season. (Miller is at 182 attempts.) Out of those 122, Miller ranks 121st in 3PT percentage.

The good news is that he would have to miss his next 25 attempts to overtake last place, so he's got that going for him.
So who’s worse than miller? I’m on the edge of my seat!
Caleb Hunter, 5'11" freshman guard from Mississippi Valley State is shooting an astounding 53/206 (25.7%) from 3 this season.
Providing quality stats like this is why we keep you around.
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by ChicagoAggie » February 20th, 2020, 9:14 pm

Guys (and Gals, and Guys who are really Gals...you know who you are)....I hate it when this board calls out an Aggie student athlete. Brock Miller contributed last year in one of our best years ever. He represented Aggie nation very well in every interview I saw or heard (some interviews on the national stage). He chose to come to school to Utah State (not BYU like Toolson or any other dumb (I can't express myself without swearing) that makes that choice).

Here is an article relevant to 3 point accuracy this year: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/287 ... all-season

I don't have any clue if extending the 3 point line is the issue, or what is going on in Miller's head. I would expect Coach Smith has some idea. Miller is a sophomore, and needs to work on his shot. He could be a great contributor and leader next year. Or we could just shut him down and say thanks, but no thanks. With Sam graduating, I'd say let's work with a kid that has the desire to be at Utah State and has the experience he has. Should his minutes for the remainder of the year be reduced, probably. Should he come off the bench, maybe. I stand by Coach Smith and the team to continue to give him a chance.

Now this is the best PG/Utah Return Missionary version I can put on this subject. I really tried here.
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by QuackAttackAggie » February 20th, 2020, 9:16 pm

deleted. info was wrong
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by FloridaAggie13 » February 20th, 2020, 9:38 pm

sockpuppet wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 7:33 pm
Re: Nike Ball
A good craftsman never blames his tools.
It's not the arrow, it's the Indian.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by QuackAttackAggie » February 20th, 2020, 9:59 pm

Alright I sorted my data better. Comparing Brock just to MWC players playing 25+ minutes (49 players qualify using this metric):

The Good:
9th best in turnover % (abel is 3rd worst and queta is 6th worst)
17th best in defensive rating (bean 2nd, queta 5, brito 6, sam 9, porter 12)
15th best in defensive win shares
4th best in turnovers/game

The Bad:
11th to last in pts/game.
seventh to last in Assist %
11th to last in assists/game

The Ugly:
Brock is last in eFG% and True Shooting %.
Second to last in player efficiency rating.
last in Defensive rebounding % and defensive rebounds/game (oddly middle of the pack in Offensive Rebounding %, and Sam is 2nd to last in ORB%)
third to last in total rebounding %
fifth to last in offensive rating
fifth to last in offensive win shares
last in FT attempts/game



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by AggieFBObsession » February 21st, 2020, 3:16 am

RigAggie wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 11:56 am
The question is, who replaces him? If you are the coach, who do you have start? My personal opinion would be to start Brito instead of him. But what say ye?
Anderson or Brito. I'd take either. I've felt this way all year.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by treesap32 » February 21st, 2020, 1:31 pm

QuackAttackAggie wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 9:59 pm
Alright I sorted my data better. Comparing Brock just to MWC players playing 25+ minutes (49 players qualify using this metric):

The Good:
9th best in turnover % (abel is 3rd worst and queta is 6th worst)
17th best in defensive rating (bean 2nd, queta 5, brito 6, sam 9, porter 12)
15th best in defensive win shares
4th best in turnovers/game

The Bad:
11th to last in pts/game.
seventh to last in Assist %
11th to last in assists/game

The Ugly:
Brock is last in eFG% and True Shooting %.
Second to last in player efficiency rating.
last in Defensive rebounding % and defensive rebounds/game (oddly middle of the pack in Offensive Rebounding %, and Sam is 2nd to last in ORB%)
third to last in total rebounding %
fifth to last in offensive rating
fifth to last in offensive win shares
last in FT attempts/game
Thanks for the stats. That last one hurts as Brock is arguably the best free throw shooter on the team. He's shooting 90% this year and 89.6% for his career. I'd love to see him pick up some of Sam's game and draw contact driving to the hoop more often.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Madmartigan » February 21st, 2020, 1:45 pm

treesap32 wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 1:31 pm
QuackAttackAggie wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 9:59 pm
Alright I sorted my data better. Comparing Brock just to MWC players playing 25+ minutes (49 players qualify using this metric):

The Good:
9th best in turnover % (abel is 3rd worst and queta is 6th worst)
17th best in defensive rating (bean 2nd, queta 5, brito 6, sam 9, porter 12)
15th best in defensive win shares
4th best in turnovers/game

The Bad:
11th to last in pts/game.
seventh to last in Assist %
11th to last in assists/game

The Ugly:
Brock is last in eFG% and True Shooting %.
Second to last in player efficiency rating.
last in Defensive rebounding % and defensive rebounds/game (oddly middle of the pack in Offensive Rebounding %, and Sam is 2nd to last in ORB%)
third to last in total rebounding %
fifth to last in offensive rating
fifth to last in offensive win shares
last in FT attempts/game
Thanks for the stats. That last one hurts as Brock is arguably the best free throw shooter on the team. He's shooting 90% this year and 89.6% for his career. I'd love to see him pick up some of Sam's game and draw contact driving to the hoop more often.
Where can a man or woman find these advanced stats? I would like to see a comparison to the alternatives: Brito, Fonzo, Bairstow.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by GUS » February 21st, 2020, 2:22 pm

At the coaches luncheon on Thursday, Coach Smith was asked about Miller's shooting. Smith is well aware of Miller's struggles. He mentioned that Miller only got 20 minutes against Wyoming. He also said that Miller is shooting well in practice and that he could go off on any time. The question was also asked about the Nike ball. Bean responded to that and you could tell he didn't want to say much. He basically said that it's something that they are getting used to and that every team has to use the same ball when they play here. It came away thinking that the ball does bother the players some.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by ColoAggie » February 21st, 2020, 2:34 pm

But he hasn't gone off. Not once. And he is unlikely to do so. So his minutes are going down, but is he shooting less? 2-3 shots a game max is all he should take.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Real Life Aggie » February 21st, 2020, 2:55 pm

ColoAggie wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 2:34 pm
But he hasn't gone off. Not once. And he is unlikely to do so. So his minutes are going down, but is he shooting less? 2-3 shots a game max is all he should take.
And, to Coach Smith's point, Miller only played 20 minutes against Wyoming. Better, Miller only attempted four 3pt shots. Given how dominate we were in the game, that doesn't seem out of line. If Miller were getting three attempts per game, that seems like a good amount. Enough that if he gets going, he can try a few more. Few enough that if they're not going down, not a huge loss.

I'm not on a crusade here. I'm not demanding that Miller be cut and we wash our hands of him. Trim back his time and rein in those 3pt attempts, and I'm happy as a clam. Let him keep up the hustle, drive the lane a bit, score on a couple of floaters, do his defensive thing, and lean into contributing however he can.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by AGGIEinIOWA » February 21st, 2020, 3:10 pm

Miller is in the top 5 in the conference (and leads the team) in a few categories related to taking care of the ball. Maybe Smith likes the fact that he doesn’t turn it over. I’m sure many of you will claim that is because he shots it as soon as he gets it.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggieguy13 » February 21st, 2020, 3:58 pm

A quick note about the idea that he just needs to drive the ball more: Brock is shooting 47.4% from 2 (37/78) this season. His effective FG% (accounting for the fact that 3 is worth more than 2) on 3 pointers this season is 43.7%. So not much of a difference. Additionally, if you were to take out 2 pointers coming off breakaway layups or dunks (not sure how many of those he has had this season) then I'm guessing that the effective FG% would be roughly the same on his 2 pointers vs. his 3 pointers on your standard half-court possession. Since he almost never gets to the line and expecting him to start doing so would require him to pretty much become an entirely different player than what he is now, that doesn't really factor into anything either. Nor does he pass all that well after attacking a closeout, so he's not really generating good looks for teammates either.

Basically, Brock trading in his threes for mid-range jumpers and floaters isn't going to help the offense any. Unless he starts making more of them, in which case he should just start making his threes instead.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Real Life Aggie » February 21st, 2020, 4:21 pm

aggieguy13 wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 3:58 pm
A quick note about the idea that he just needs to drive the ball more: Brock is shooting 47.4% from 2 (37/78) this season. His effective FG% (accounting for the fact that 3 is worth more than 2) on 3 pointers this season is 43.7%. So not much of a difference. Additionally, if you were to take out 2 pointers coming off breakaway layups or dunks (not sure how many of those he has had this season) then I'm guessing that the effective FG% would be roughly the same on his 2 pointers vs. his 3 pointers on your standard half-court possession. Since he almost never gets to the line and expecting him to start doing so would require him to pretty much become an entirely different player than what he is now, that doesn't really factor into anything either. Nor does he pass all that well after attacking a closeout, so he's not really generating good looks for teammates either.

Basically, Brock trading in his threes for mid-range jumpers and floaters isn't going to help the offense any. Unless he starts making more of them, in which case he should just start making his threes instead.
I guess that's basically what I'm looking for.

What I've taken away from this is hope he improves like crazy in the off-season, because otherwise he's pretty meh.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by ususports » February 21st, 2020, 4:41 pm

I don't know if it is just me, but has anyone else noticed that Miller is in a bit of a shooting slump?



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by hickaggie » February 21st, 2020, 4:44 pm

AGGIEinIOWA wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 3:10 pm
Miller is in the top 5 in the conference (and leads the team) in a few categories related to taking care of the ball. Maybe Smith likes the fact that he doesn’t turn it over. I’m sure many of you will claim that is because he shots it as soon as he gets it.
Every shot is pretty much a TO so that stat doesn't mean much.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggieguy13 » February 21st, 2020, 4:48 pm

Real Life Aggie wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 4:21 pm
aggieguy13 wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 3:58 pm
A quick note about the idea that he just needs to drive the ball more: Brock is shooting 47.4% from 2 (37/78) this season. His effective FG% (accounting for the fact that 3 is worth more than 2) on 3 pointers this season is 43.7%. So not much of a difference. Additionally, if you were to take out 2 pointers coming off breakaway layups or dunks (not sure how many of those he has had this season) then I'm guessing that the effective FG% would be roughly the same on his 2 pointers vs. his 3 pointers on your standard half-court possession. Since he almost never gets to the line and expecting him to start doing so would require him to pretty much become an entirely different player than what he is now, that doesn't really factor into anything either. Nor does he pass all that well after attacking a closeout, so he's not really generating good looks for teammates either.

Basically, Brock trading in his threes for mid-range jumpers and floaters isn't going to help the offense any. Unless he starts making more of them, in which case he should just start making his threes instead.
I guess that's basically what I'm looking for.

What I've taken away from this is hope he improves like crazy in the off-season, because otherwise he's pretty meh.
Yeah. I don't see him becoming a different type of player than what he is now. And even if he did focus on becoming more of a slasher/finisher around the rim, I don't see him being better at it than random JuCo wing X we could get here at any time.

It's boring to say, but ultimately his best chance at consistently contributing to winning at this level lies in just shooting better. A guy that shoots 37% from 3, hustles, and plays above-average defense is a valuable rotation piece.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Yossarian » February 21st, 2020, 4:55 pm

Sl7vk wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 8:19 pm
aggieguy13 wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 7:50 pm
Sl7vk wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 6:28 pm
aggieguy13 wrote:
February 20th, 2020, 4:38 pm
Just to give some further context as to what we're watching: There are 122 D-1 players who have shot 166 or more threes this season. (Miller is at 182 attempts.) Out of those 122, Miller ranks 121st in 3PT percentage.

The good news is that he would have to miss his next 25 attempts to overtake last place, so he's got that going for him.
So who’s worse than miller? I’m on the edge of my seat!
Caleb Hunter, 5'11" freshman guard from Mississippi Valley State is shooting an astounding 53/206 (25.7%) from 3 this season.
And they are 2-23 currently.
Thank goodness Hunter is making 25% of his threes or they would really be in trouble.
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by GUS » February 21st, 2020, 5:03 pm

According to Smith, we have some players sitting out or coming in that can shoot the 3 quite efficiently. If Miller doesn't improve his game over the summer he may lose a ton of minutes. Smith also talked like there could be one or two transfer outs. Now those could be the walk-ons, or it could be Miller. It could be that everyone stays. Smith just said with the transfer mentality out there, that it always is a possibility.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by AGGIEinIOWA » February 21st, 2020, 5:54 pm

hickaggie wrote:
AGGIEinIOWA wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 3:10 pm
Miller is in the top 5 in the conference (and leads the team) in a few categories related to taking care of the ball. Maybe Smith likes the fact that he doesn’t turn it over. I’m sure many of you will claim that is because he shots it as soon as he gets it.
Every shot is pretty much a TO so that stat doesn't mean much.
I was waiting for someone to make that point. Lol



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by dyedblue » February 21st, 2020, 6:03 pm

aggieguy13 wrote:A quick note about the idea that he just needs to drive the ball more: Brock is shooting 47.4% from 2 (37/78) this season. His effective FG% (accounting for the fact that 3 is worth more than 2) on 3 pointers this season is 43.7%. So not much of a difference. Additionally, if you were to take out 2 pointers coming off breakaway layups or dunks (not sure how many of those he has had this season) then I'm guessing that the effective FG% would be roughly the same on his 2 pointers vs. his 3 pointers on your standard half-court possession. Since he almost never gets to the line and expecting him to start doing so would require him to pretty much become an entirely different player than what he is now, that doesn't really factor into anything either. Nor does he pass all that well after attacking a closeout, so he's not really generating good looks for teammates either.

Basically, Brock trading in his threes for mid-range jumpers and floaters isn't going to help the offense any. Unless he starts making more of them, in which case he should just start making his threes instead.

True, but his shots tape away shots from other players. If he takes six as game instead of ten then four shots go to other players


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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by NVAggie » February 21st, 2020, 6:20 pm

Miller just needs to hit the open shots. Plain and simple. If he can’t do that then he needs to figure out what he can do. He isn’t a good shooter. That is his thing. If he can’t do that someone will. By the way, he shot 4 threes in the first half of the Wyoming game. He ended up shooting 7 total. I hope his slump ends. We need his shooting.
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by bpd » February 21st, 2020, 8:45 pm

GUS wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 5:03 pm
According to Smith, we have some players sitting out or coming in that can shoot the 3 quite efficiently. If Miller doesn't improve his game over the summer he may lose a ton of minutes. Smith also talked like there could be one or two transfer outs. Now those could be the walk-ons, or it could be Miller. It could be that everyone stays. Smith just said with the transfer mentality out there, that it always is a possibility.
Transfers... I could see Kuba transferring unless Queta leaves and maybe Anderson.

Gus, did he say anything about recruiting?



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by GUS » February 22nd, 2020, 7:39 am

Said they have one or two scholarships left depending on what happens with Queta. He said the feedback on Queta is all over the map and he may or may not stay. The first scholly is going to another guard, probably a high school one. The second, if needed, would go to the best available player out there remaining. He likened it to the NBA draft. Sometimes teams take the best player left out there, rather than trying to fill a specific need.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by slcagg » February 22nd, 2020, 7:44 am

GUS wrote:
February 22nd, 2020, 7:39 am
Said they have one or two scholarships left depending on what happens with Queta. He said the feedback on Queta is all over the map and he may or may not stay. The first scholly is going to another guard, probably a high school one. The second, if needed, would go to the best available player out there remaining. He likened it to the NBA draft. Sometimes teams take the best player left out there, rather than trying to fill a specific need.
Was this at a luncheon?

We need another guard/wing. Right now between those three positions we have bairstow, Miller, Anthony and bischoff returning for those 3 positions. Then two freshman guards coming in. Maybe mcchesney can play some 3? We need a scorer in this group. Can that be Anthony? Maybe but we need another ideally.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by GUS » February 22nd, 2020, 8:30 am

Yes, the coaches luncheon the past Thursday.
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggies22 » February 22nd, 2020, 8:43 am

ususports wrote:
February 21st, 2020, 4:41 pm
I don't know if it is just me, but has anyone else noticed that Miller is in a bit of a shooting slump?
I was starting to wonder?
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggies22 » February 22nd, 2020, 8:49 am

slcagg wrote:
February 22nd, 2020, 7:44 am
GUS wrote:
February 22nd, 2020, 7:39 am
Said they have one or two scholarships left depending on what happens with Queta. He said the feedback on Queta is all over the map and he may or may not stay. The first scholly is going to another guard, probably a high school one. The second, if needed, would go to the best available player out there remaining. He likened it to the NBA draft. Sometimes teams take the best player left out there, rather than trying to fill a specific need.
Was this at a luncheon?

We need another guard/wing. Right now between those three positions we have bairstow, Miller, Anthony and bischoff returning for those 3 positions. Then two freshman guards coming in. Maybe mcchesney can play some 3? We need a scorer in this group. Can that be Anthony? Maybe but we need another ideally.
Anthony is a scorer. The comment about a high school guard surprises me though. I've been given no indication or seen any evidence of us even interested in a guard at that level.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggies22 » February 22nd, 2020, 9:00 am

I am hoping that Miller has a Brito-like turn around his final two seasons here. Many on this board were very critical of Brito as a freshman and although he's had some trouble with consistency this season, he's clearly become one of the guys that makes things work. Miller isn't bad enough to counsel out but if things don't change effeciency wise from his sophomore to his junior season, it's going to become more and more difficult for Coach Smith to justify having him on the floor.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by GUS » February 22nd, 2020, 9:46 am

I agree 22. Smith seemed really excited with the shooting ability of McChesney, Anthony and Bischoff. If they can outshoot Miller, then Miller's minutes will be limited.
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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggies22 » February 22nd, 2020, 9:50 am

GUS wrote:
February 22nd, 2020, 9:46 am
I agree 22. Smith seemed really excited with the shooting ability of McChesney, Anthony and Bischoff. If they can outshoot Miller, then Miller's minutes will be limited.
I'm not saying he's going to end up on scholarship but I've been told that Carson Bischoff is much better than expected.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by Blitz79 » February 22nd, 2020, 10:43 am

Not saying Bischoff is not good but apparently being good in practice doesn't mean they are good in game.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by GUS » February 22nd, 2020, 12:00 pm

I would be surprised if Bischoff was on scholarship at the first of next season. Smith talked like he would still be a walk on along with Dorius.



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Re: Miller 1st half: 0-5 fg, 0-4 3pt

Post by aggies22 » February 22nd, 2020, 12:54 pm

GUS wrote:
February 22nd, 2020, 12:00 pm
I would be surprised if Bischoff was on scholarship at the first of next season. Smith talked like he would still be a walk on along with Dorius.
Absolutely zero chance Dorius and Bischoff end up on scholarship.



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