Kuba?

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Yossarian
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Re: Kuba?

Post by Yossarian » February 12th, 2020, 11:48 am

Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
Nowitzki, Dirk
Porzingis, Kristaps



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Re: Kuba?

Post by brian5562 » February 12th, 2020, 11:53 am

Yossarian wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:48 am
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
Nowitzki, Dirk
Porzingis, Kristaps
Your point about defense is why having a big that can shoot the 3 is huge. Take the big man away from the basket and it opens up driving lanes. Look what happens to the Jazz wen Gobert is forced to go out on the perimeter



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Re: Kuba?

Post by Aggie19 » February 12th, 2020, 12:01 pm

dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:39 am
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
We pull the center up for pick n rolls and hand offs as it is. If neither of those options are there, and the 3 is open, then why not? They're already out of place for rebounding and inside out play.
The idea being the roll to the basket after the pick, putting him in position. But if that's not there, the next best option is for him to shoot the 3? Or should the guard be given the ball and the play reset? I'm not saying that he can't shoot them, I'm arguing that it's not the best for our offense to have him do so and given what we've seen so far, he has more important things to work on. Occasional is fine, given a situation, but to give him the go ahead to pull the trigger, I wouldn't.


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Re: Kuba?

Post by dirtnsnow » February 12th, 2020, 12:07 pm

Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:01 pm
dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:39 am
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
We pull the center up for pick n rolls and hand offs as it is. If neither of those options are there, and the 3 is open, then why not? They're already out of place for rebounding and inside out play.
The idea being the roll to the basket after the pick, putting him in position. But if that's not there, the next best option is for him to shoot the 3? Or should the guard be given the ball and the play reset? I'm not saying that he can't shoot them, I'm arguing that it's not the best for our offense to have him do so and given what we've seen so far, he has more important things to work on. Occasional is fine, given a situation, but to give him the go ahead to pull the trigger, I wouldn't.
I'd argue that wasn't the first, second, or even third option. CSU took away those other options. He had the ball, so pick n roll wasn't there. The intent was to hand the ball off to either of the players that flashed to the top, but CSU hedged on both and dropped their center to prevent a backdoor cut. At this point, he's wide open with the defense daring him to shoot it. In today's game, that is a shot that even big guys are supposed to take. Marc Gasol redeveloped his game in the last couple of years to address this specific scenario; it's not unheard of.


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Re: Kuba?

Post by FloridaAggie13 » February 12th, 2020, 12:19 pm

dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:17 am
FloridaAggie13 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:11 am
ususports wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 10:14 am
FloridaAggie13 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 9:40 am
Yes, but within context. Able Porter isn't posting on the low block looking for an open look.
But if he is wide open on the low block, shouldn't he take the shot?
Of course, why wouldn't he?

The point I was making is that we don't run plays for the point guard to post up on the low block any more than we run plays for the center to shoot from 22 feet. Just because Kuba has the ball and is open from 22 feet doesn't mean that he should shoot it.

Of course, if over time he proves that is a shot he can make consistently, then sure.
Chicken and the egg situation here. How is he going to prove he can shoot it if he isn't allowed to shoot it? He only had one less made 3 than Miller last night.
How do we know Able Porter can't post on the low block if he isn't allowed?

Kuba and the other big men in the offense have a specific role to play within the offense. When they are at the top of key, as he was, it is to screen for the guard and then roll to the basket / get in position for a rebound.

Kuba will have to prove it practice over and over again before Smith gives the green light to him from 22 feet.

And to be clear, I'm not defending Miller's inept shooting.



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Re: Kuba?

Post by FloridaAggie13 » February 12th, 2020, 12:22 pm

dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:07 pm
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:01 pm
dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:39 am
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
We pull the center up for pick n rolls and hand offs as it is. If neither of those options are there, and the 3 is open, then why not? They're already out of place for rebounding and inside out play.
The idea being the roll to the basket after the pick, putting him in position. But if that's not there, the next best option is for him to shoot the 3? Or should the guard be given the ball and the play reset? I'm not saying that he can't shoot them, I'm arguing that it's not the best for our offense to have him do so and given what we've seen so far, he has more important things to work on. Occasional is fine, given a situation, but to give him the go ahead to pull the trigger, I wouldn't.
I'd argue that wasn't the first, second, or even third option. CSU took away those other options. He had the ball, so pick n roll wasn't there. The intent was to hand the ball off to either of the players that flashed to the top, but CSU hedged on both and dropped their center to prevent a backdoor cut. At this point, he's wide open with the defense daring him to shoot it. In today's game, that is a shot that even big guys are supposed to take. Marc Gasol redeveloped his game in the last couple of years to address this specific scenario; it's not unheard of.
Yeah, it isn't unheard of. I watched Bill Laimbeer make 20 footers throughout the 1980's. The point we are making is that probably isn't in his proven skill set no different than Abel Porter finding himself with the ball on the low block with his back to the basket.



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Re: Kuba?

Post by dirtnsnow » February 12th, 2020, 12:30 pm

FloridaAggie13 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:22 pm
dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:07 pm
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:01 pm
dirtnsnow wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:39 am
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
We pull the center up for pick n rolls and hand offs as it is. If neither of those options are there, and the 3 is open, then why not? They're already out of place for rebounding and inside out play.
The idea being the roll to the basket after the pick, putting him in position. But if that's not there, the next best option is for him to shoot the 3? Or should the guard be given the ball and the play reset? I'm not saying that he can't shoot them, I'm arguing that it's not the best for our offense to have him do so and given what we've seen so far, he has more important things to work on. Occasional is fine, given a situation, but to give him the go ahead to pull the trigger, I wouldn't.
I'd argue that wasn't the first, second, or even third option. CSU took away those other options. He had the ball, so pick n roll wasn't there. The intent was to hand the ball off to either of the players that flashed to the top, but CSU hedged on both and dropped their center to prevent a backdoor cut. At this point, he's wide open with the defense daring him to shoot it. In today's game, that is a shot that even big guys are supposed to take. Marc Gasol redeveloped his game in the last couple of years to address this specific scenario; it's not unheard of.
Yeah, it isn't unheard of. I watched Bill Laimbeer make 20 footers throughout the 1980's. The point we are making is that probably isn't in his proven skill set no different than Abel Porter finding himself with the ball on the low block with his back to the basket.
And yet, if there was a mismatch to be exploited, I'd be ok with the coach calling for Porter to post up. If the opposing player was 4'8" or if they were leaving Porter open to double Queta, I'd hope they would get him the ball, even if he was down low. We've seen Sam do it occasionally for the same purpose, though that's not really his game.
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Re: Kuba?

Post by jwaggie » February 12th, 2020, 12:35 pm

Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
I'm not saying we want Kuba shooting threes but isn't this one reason a big that can shoot threes can be so valuable?
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Re: Kuba?

Post by Aggie19 » February 12th, 2020, 12:51 pm

jwaggie wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 12:35 pm
Aggie19 wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 11:30 am
I'm not sure I want my 7'+ center taking 3s ever. Takes him further away from where I need him, in the post and rebounding. Or catching it inside and kicking it out when it collapses. It should be a rarity that he's shooting 3s. He should focus on his down low game and defense. Our offense works the best when we have a post player that can work underneath and kick it out. Defense is better all around, for every team, when there a big guy clogging the middle and cleaning up mistakes from the perimeter d. Let's work on that.
I'm not saying we want Kuba shooting threes but isn't this one reason a big that can shoot threes can be so valuable?
I think we're saying the same thing, honestly. Occasional 3s are fine and would do what you say
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Re: Kuba?

Post by bpd » February 12th, 2020, 1:15 pm

I was at the game. Craig was not happy with the shot. Probably because Kuba hasn't made a 3 in game yet and probably because he would like Kuba to shoot on the block, which he didn't do. After the game Kuba was talking to some friends and Craig came out and congratulated him on the game and half joking said, just stop shooting those 3s.

Kuba should establish himself on the block then move out if he can.... just like Queta has.



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Re: Kuba?

Post by tipitup » February 12th, 2020, 1:32 pm

i think kuba's shot was just real quick into the offense. not enough passes, for him, to shoot it. Someone else it may have been ok, because of how open he was.



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Re: Kuba?

Post by ThunderAggie » February 12th, 2020, 1:34 pm

bpd wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 1:15 pm
I was at the game. Craig was not happy with the shot. Probably because Kuba hasn't made a 3 in game yet and probably because he would like Kuba to shoot on the block, which he didn't do. After the game Kuba was talking to some friends and Craig came out and congratulated him on the game and half joking said, just stop shooting those 3s.

Kuba should establish himself on the block then move out if he can.... just like Queta has.
Can he please tell Miller this!?



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Re: Kuba?

Post by brownjeans » February 12th, 2020, 1:38 pm

tipitup wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 1:32 pm
i think kuba's shot was just real quick into the offense. not enough passes, for him, to shoot it. Someone else it may have been ok, because of how open he was.
Except Merrill, who would that someone else be? I mean, it's not like we have four great shooters on the floor at any given time.
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Re: Kuba?

Post by tipitup » February 12th, 2020, 1:49 pm

right, but like you said, who would that someone else be? we have enough one the floor that wont take a shot now or are so skittish that it's not a good shot. we only have so many, with miller, brito, porter, anderson, bean and bairstow who can't hit a jump shot, who do we have that shoots it!!! i think we still need 5 players on the floor.



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Re: Kuba?

Post by tipitup » February 12th, 2020, 1:49 pm

brownjeans wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 1:38 pm
tipitup wrote:
February 12th, 2020, 1:32 pm
i think kuba's shot was just real quick into the offense. not enough passes, for him, to shoot it. Someone else it may have been ok, because of how open he was.
Except Merrill, who would that someone else be? I mean, it's not like we have four great shooters on the floor at any given time.
right, but like you said, who would that someone else be? we have enough one the floor that wont take a shot now or are so skittish that it's not a good shot. we only have so many, with miller, brito, porter, anderson, bean and bairstow who can't hit a jump shot, who do we have that shoots it!!! i think we still need 5 players on the floor.



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Kuba?

Post by Usu0505 » February 12th, 2020, 1:50 pm

Either way if we get Kuba back to full strength it will add a massive amount of depth to our center position. Quetta getting in foul trouble won’t hurt nearly as bad.

Kuba is good. I was very much wondering why he wasn’t playing. Super happy to hear he wasn’t in the dog house or had stopped trying as someone had mentioned.


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