Miller's shot

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Miller's shot

Post by FireAg » January 22nd, 2020, 7:07 am

Seems to be off and has been for several games. I think it's a concentration issue. He's trying too hard to make it go in - he needs to relax when he shoots. In order for us to recover the season, Miller (and Porter) need to make their open 3's.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by sam tingey » January 22nd, 2020, 7:26 am

Is it bad of me to think to myself that it will be a miss whenever Miller takes a 3? I think its bad of me, but it keeps me from getting too let down now. I really want Miller to make one when we are rolling so the roof can be blown off the spectrum, but he will miss it and kill the mood a little.
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by dyedblue » January 22nd, 2020, 7:28 am

sam tingey wrote:Is it bad of me to think to myself that it will be a miss whenever Miller takes a 3? I think its bad of me, but it keeps me from getting too let down now. I really want Miller to make one when we are rolling so the roof can be blown off the spectrum, but he will miss it and kill the mood a little.
I’ve thought that since midway through the conference schedule last season...


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Re: Miller's shot

Post by bigblue » January 22nd, 2020, 7:45 am

It's terrible. You hear a groan from everyone in the crowd when Miller shots it. Coach has to hear that.

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Re: Miller's shot

Post by AngusAg » January 22nd, 2020, 8:09 am

Besides countless hours of practice, shooting is a rhythm thing. Miller is out of rhythm. There's a difference between just shooting and shooting in rhythm. Miller is just shooting in an effort to find his shot. In addition to consistently squaring up, setting his feet and focusing more, he needs to move in until he gets in rhythm and then start moving out. Foul shots, among other things, can be an excellent way to find rhythm. Watch his warm up routine, its a 100% 3 pters. Miller is trying to win at Battleship with a random number generator.
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by aggiesdotcom » January 22nd, 2020, 8:20 am

bigblue wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 7:45 am
It's terrible. You hear a groan from everyone in the crowd when Miller shots it. Coach has to hear that.

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Our section had a bit of a chuckle after what I believe was Miller's 5th missed 3 of the game when you could hear a collective groan in the crowd when he began his shooting motion. He's averaging close to 5 missed 3's per game so I guess it's a conditioned response at this point.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by hickaggie » January 22nd, 2020, 8:22 am

Miller is a momentum killer. If he has to be out there Smith needs to instruct him to pass his way out of the slump to Queta inside rather than shoot his way out.
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by ChicAggie » January 22nd, 2020, 8:41 am

AngusAg wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 8:09 am
Miller is trying to win at Battleship with a random number generator.
Why are you suddenly attacking my Battleship strategy!? Seems a bit personal.
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by ChicAggie » January 22nd, 2020, 8:51 am

How about that 1-on-4 25-foot attempt by Miller in the first half? I believe it was the one right after the Bean steal. I can't believe that is the shot Coach Smith wants on that play. Miller is .239 from beyond the arc in conference play (.216 coming into last night's game), which translates to only .717 points per shot attempt. Considering that the average 3-point shooter in college makes roughly 35.2% of shots -- or 1.06 points per shot attempt -- Miller's volume inefficiency (6.6 3PA/game) is killing the Ags.


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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Dwigt » January 22nd, 2020, 8:53 am

FireAg wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 7:07 am
Seems to be off and has been for several games. I think it's a concentration issue. He's trying too hard to make it go in - he needs to relax when he shoots. In order for us to recover the season, Miller (and Porter) need to make their open 3's.
Goon?
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by superaggie » January 22nd, 2020, 9:02 am



This is what I think of every time MIller shoots.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Agzrule » January 22nd, 2020, 9:09 am

When he is square and steps into his shot he is accurate, when shooting off the dribble or pump fake not so much



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Real Life Aggie » January 22nd, 2020, 9:36 am

When he takes a three, we need to request that the opposing team slows down for a second, stands politely like they're waiting for the sacrament tray to make its way across the row, and doesn't look at him directly. Once we can get teams to do that, he's just going to be automatic.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by tipitup » January 22nd, 2020, 10:04 am

one thing that i noticed is that, for a majority of his shots, he is probably the closest misser of three point shooters i have ever seen. so many of his threes are down and then come out. there are some outliers that just plain miss, but it seems like he has a lot that go down and come out, that is so frustrating for a shooter, because you're almost there, so you keep shooting!! just my two bits.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Mr. Sneelock » January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm

He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't. There's no other way to say it. He is well below average for all college basketball players. We have enough of a sample size by now to stop saying he is in a slump and start just calling it like it is. He might get hot once in a blue moon, but those rare occasions are clearly the exception.

So the question is what else is he good at to justify his minutes?
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by OrangeCountyAggie » January 22nd, 2020, 1:44 pm

FireAg wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 7:07 am
Seems to be off and has been for several games. I think it's a concentration issue. He's trying too hard to make it go in - he needs to relax when he shoots. In order for us to recover the season, Miller (and Porter) need to make their open 3's.
He's been off for a season and a half! When is this coaching staff going to realize that he's not a good shooter and STOP LETTING HIM SHOOT!!! Last night on a fast break, he jacked up a brick shot from 35 feet before our bigs could even get in position to rebound like he's Jimmer Ferdette. Nobody guards him and defenders routinely dare him to shoot every time he touches the ball. Seriously, this s**t has to stop! :bangwall:



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by OrangeCountyAggie » January 22nd, 2020, 1:49 pm

Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't. There's no other way to say it. He is well below average for all college basketball players. We have enough of a sample size by now to stop saying he is in a slump and start just calling it like it is. He might get hot once in a blue moon, but those rare occasions are clearly the exception.

So the question is what else is he good at to justify his minutes?
Well, he's slow, unathletic, can't pass, can't guard, can't drive, doesn't rebound. Maybe it's because he knows the offense and looks like coach Smith? :headscratch:
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Aglicious » January 22nd, 2020, 1:49 pm

Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't. There's no other way to say it. He is well below average for all college basketball players. We have enough of a sample size by now to stop saying he is in a slump and start just calling it like it is. He might get hot once in a blue moon, but those rare occasions are clearly the exception.

So the question is what else is he good at to justify his minutes?
It's really hard to draw any other conclusion at this point about his 3pt ability. I think because we have seen him take so many 3's we have bought into the notion that it is "his thing" or that he must be good at it because the coaches continue to let him do it. Reality tells us he is not a great or even good 3pt shooter though.
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Aggie in Boise » January 22nd, 2020, 2:31 pm

It's interesting that as much as Brock has struggled his shooting (FG, 3Pt, and FT) percentages are equal to or better than Koby McEwens. :headscratch: Other stats are pretty similar with the exception of rebounds, assists, fouls, and turn overs.

Koby McEwen Stats
GP MIN FG% 3P% FT% REB AST BLK STL PF TO PTS
18 29.6 32.8 31.9 84.2 4.8 3.2 0.1 0.8 3.2 2.6 9.6

Brock Miller Stats
GP MIN FG% 3P% FT% REB AST BLK STL PF TO PTS
21 29.0 37.2 31.2 88.9 2.5 1.3 0.0 0.6 1.7 1.2 9.8

I thought it would be a good idea to bring Koby into the conversation since nobody has mentioned him for a little while. :stirpot:
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by sstewboy » January 22nd, 2020, 3:31 pm

Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't.
But we know that isn't true, right? Yes, his numbers are down this year, but look at his stretch last year of conference games + conference tournament + NCAA tournament. He shot 38% from 3 over that period of time. If you subtract his 1 for 9 performance during that stretch against New Mexico (at home), he shot 40%.

Don't get me wrong, his shot selection drives me crazy and he seems to miss every step back three/contested three. So he should limit his shots to those that happen in the flow of the offense. But, we have enough information to know he's capable of making shots unless we want to chalk last year up to an anomaly (which it appears to have been for Brito's three point percentage).

Finally, I have watched Brock closely the last few games because I too have wondered what else he's adding on the court. I have noticed a significant uptick in hustle plays, rebound attempts, and more energetic defensive play. In those areas, I think he is much more solid than Bairstow at this time. Just my opinion, of course.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Blitz79 » January 22nd, 2020, 5:26 pm

Bah! If you subtract his worst game then subtract his best game as well. He can't move laterally, he plays torero defense.

17-18-------------9-19 47.4%
18-19----------70-198 35.4%
19-20----------43-138 31.2%

Trending the wrong way and his best games are against the weakest competition. Come on Brock! GATA!



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by OrangeCountyAggie » January 22nd, 2020, 5:30 pm

sstewboy wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 3:31 pm
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't.
But we know that isn't true, right? Yes, his numbers are down this year, but look at his stretch last year of conference games + conference tournament + NCAA tournament. He shot 38% from 3 over that period of time. If you subtract his 1 for 9 performance during that stretch against New Mexico (at home), he shot 40%.

Don't get me wrong, his shot selection drives me crazy and he seems to miss every step back three/contested three. So he should limit his shots to those that happen in the flow of the offense. But, we have enough information to know he's capable of making shots unless we want to chalk last year up to an anomaly (which it appears to have been for Brito's three point percentage).

Finally, I have watched Brock closely the last few games because I too have wondered what else he's adding on the court. I have noticed a significant uptick in hustle plays, rebound attempts, and more energetic defensive play. In those areas, I think he is much more solid than Bairstow at this time. Just my opinion, of course.
If you remove the 5 games played in 2017-18 season (against horrible early-season competition) he's a 33% career three-point shooter. FACTS.

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Re: Miller's shot

Post by hipsterdoofus21 » January 22nd, 2020, 5:42 pm

I actually think Brock can shoot, but his shot selection this season has been poor to which some have alluded. If he stuck to 3-4 attempts from 3 that were more set shots or step into shots I think we’d see a > 40% success rate and he could still take the occasional pump fake and dribble pull up. Instead it’s like he has a goal to shoot 7-8 threes a game and isn’t sure when those attempts will come so he just lets it fly every time.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by 2004AG » January 22nd, 2020, 6:06 pm

sstewboy wrote:
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't.
But we know that isn't true, right? Yes, his numbers are down this year, but look at his stretch last year of conference games + conference tournament + NCAA tournament. He shot 38% from 3 over that period of time. If you subtract his 1 for 9 performance during that stretch against New Mexico (at home), he shot 40%.

Don't get me wrong, his shot selection drives me crazy and he seems to miss every step back three/contested three. So he should limit his shots to those that happen in the flow of the offense. But, we have enough information to know he's capable of making shots unless we want to chalk last year up to an anomaly (which it appears to have been for Brito's three point percentage).

Finally, I have watched Brock closely the last few games because I too have wondered what else he's adding on the court. I have noticed a significant uptick in hustle plays, rebound attempts, and more energetic defensive play. In those areas, I think he is much more solid than Bairstow at this time. Just my opinion, of course.
He’s not a good shooter.


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Re: Miller's shot

Post by ColoAggie » January 22nd, 2020, 6:24 pm

sstewboy wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 3:31 pm
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't.
But we know that isn't true, right? Yes, his numbers are down this year, but look at his stretch last year of conference games + conference tournament + NCAA tournament. He shot 38% from 3 over that period of time. If you subtract his 1 for 9 performance during that stretch against New Mexico (at home), he shot 40%.

Don't get me wrong, his shot selection drives me crazy and he seems to miss every step back three/contested three. So he should limit his shots to those that happen in the flow of the offense. But, we have enough information to know he's capable of making shots unless we want to chalk last year up to an anomaly (which it appears to have been for Brito's three point percentage).

Finally, I have watched Brock closely the last few games because I too have wondered what else he's adding on the court. I have noticed a significant uptick in hustle plays, rebound attempts, and more energetic defensive play. In those areas, I think he is much more solid than Bairstow at this time. Just my opinion, of course.
I wasn't aware that "rebound attempts" was a stat. I really think you're grasping at straws here. It's great to be positive, but he is what he is, and that's a poor shooter. Crew Ainge was "energetic" too, but, well, he sucked.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by dyedblue » January 22nd, 2020, 7:08 pm

sstewboy wrote:
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't.
But we know that isn't true, right? Yes, his numbers are down this year, but look at his stretch last year of conference games + conference tournament + NCAA tournament. He shot 38% from 3 over that period of time. If you subtract his 1 for 9 performance during that stretch against New Mexico (at home), he shot 40%.

Don't get me wrong, his shot selection drives me crazy and he seems to miss every step back three/contested three. So he should limit his shots to those that happen in the flow of the offense. But, we have enough information to know he's capable of making shots unless we want to chalk last year up to an anomaly (which it appears to have been for Brito's three point percentage).

Finally, I have watched Brock closely the last few games because I too have wondered what else he's adding on the court. I have noticed a significant uptick in hustle plays, rebound attempts, and more energetic defensive play. In those areas, I think he is much more solid than Bairstow at this time. Just my opinion, of course.
What? Like the one later in the second half when the defender blew by him at the the point line as he swiped at the ball. He realized he was screwed so he jumped out to left elbow extended to guard against the kick out but the Air Force player was lining it up from the right side. That’s a thing of beauty right there.

I have a friend who went to the game last night. It was his first Aggie game ever. He loved Merrill, was intrigued by how big and smooth Queta played, and said he felt bad for Miller. He mentioned the crowd groaned every time he sit in the second half. I saw another post mentioning that and thought it was made up.

At this point I really do feel bad for the kid. I could go on, but there is no need to pile on. At least the mistakes Bairstow makes are mistakes that will get worked out with more playing time and experience. Miller is in his third year.


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Re: Miller's shot

Post by bullshot » January 22nd, 2020, 7:19 pm

I thought I heard yesterday on the radio that USU’s 3 pt % is 349th out of 350. Too lazy to verify, but sounds about right.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by sneed » January 22nd, 2020, 7:41 pm

bullshot wrote:I thought I heard yesterday on the radio that USU’s 3 pt % is 349th out of 350. Too lazy to verify, but sounds about right.
#246. Not good. Maybe the 349 is since conference play - I would believe that.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by TrueBlueFan » January 22nd, 2020, 10:20 pm

Dang. I played Brock in a tournament back in 8th grade. He torched out team for 27 points , making 7 three pointers. I wish we had that Brock.


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Re: Miller's shot

Post by aggiesdotcom » January 23rd, 2020, 10:17 am



Brock Miller being played by George Costanza being played by Jason Alexander.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOhvYhyzKjM



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Real Life Aggie » January 23rd, 2020, 11:42 am

aggiesdotcom wrote:
January 23rd, 2020, 10:17 am


Brock Miller being played by George Costanza being played by Jason Alexander.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOhvYhyzKjM
Jerry is Sam
George is Miller
Kramer is Queta
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Re: Miller's shot

Post by Mr. Sneelock » January 23rd, 2020, 11:52 am

sstewboy wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 3:31 pm
Mr. Sneelock wrote:
January 22nd, 2020, 1:36 pm
He isn't a good 3 pt shooter. He just isn't.
But we know that isn't true, right? Yes, his numbers are down this year, but look at his stretch last year of conference games + conference tournament + NCAA tournament. He shot 38% from 3 over that period of time. If you subtract his 1 for 9 performance during that stretch against New Mexico (at home), he shot 40%.

Don't get me wrong, his shot selection drives me crazy and he seems to miss every step back three/contested three. So he should limit his shots to those that happen in the flow of the offense. But, we have enough information to know he's capable of making shots unless we want to chalk last year up to an anomaly (which it appears to have been for Brito's three point percentage).

Finally, I have watched Brock closely the last few games because I too have wondered what else he's adding on the court. I have noticed a significant uptick in hustle plays, rebound attempts, and more energetic defensive play. In those areas, I think he is much more solid than Bairstow at this time. Just my opinion, of course.
I do think he has been hustling more the past few games and been trying to make more positive contributions in other ways. That said, I don't see how you can use selective stats to argue with a straight face that he is a good shooter. I would rather just look at the whole body of work vs selectively removing his worst performances or focusing only on his best. We judge everyone else by all of their games, and their averages throughout the year or their careers. In Brock's case, there is a very noticeable downward trend. One or two bad shooting nights among mostly good performances may be an anomaly. If you consistently have bad shooting nights, that is who you are and the good night's become the anomaly. That's where we are with Brock.

We have a large enough sample size to know who he is. And when you dig a little deeper, you see that his rare hot streaks don't seem to be so random. They almost always come against vastly inferior teams. Is it a scheme issue? Is it a talent issue? Is it a mental issue? Is it a teammate incompatibility issue? Some combination? I don't know. But what I do know is that he isn't making them, he hasn't been making them for a long while now, and his shooting percentages over a long period of time don't come close to justifying the number of shots he takes. To justify that many shots, he really needs to be around 40%.

Don't get me wrong. I like Brock. I just wish he would either start making or stop shooting.


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Re: Miller's shot

Post by FloridaAggie13 » January 23rd, 2020, 12:03 pm

Real Life Aggie wrote:
January 23rd, 2020, 11:42 am
aggiesdotcom wrote:
January 23rd, 2020, 10:17 am


Brock Miller being played by George Costanza being played by Jason Alexander.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOhvYhyzKjM
Jerry is Sam
George is Miller
Kramer is Queta
One of my favorite Seinfeld scenes of all time!

Right now Brock is that guy standing along the sidelines in the Field House that no one wants to pick because they know he is a black hole with the ball.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by FloridaAggie13 » January 23rd, 2020, 12:09 pm

The 1989-90 team had a guard named Matt Barnes who Kohn Smith brought in as a three-point shooter. Pre-game-warmups-Matt was lights out. Game-time-Matt chipped paint off the rim and cracked backboards. I believe at one point his three-point % was in the low 20's and he barely made it on the court come mid-January. I remember fans being pretty rough on him as well.

In all fairness, he seemed to be a good guy and probably was a really talented shooter (or wouldn't be on a D1 basketball team), but I would think that a five or six game slump has to cause the player to question his ability and mess with his confidence.



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Re: Miller's shot

Post by sstewboy » January 23rd, 2020, 2:23 pm

[/quote]
and his shooting percentages over a long period of time don't come close to justifying the number of shots he takes.
[/quote]

I completely agree with this statement. I guess the point I was trying to make, and it's the same point Hipster makes above, is Brock can be a good shooter, but his shot selection is really poor at times. When he shoots in the flow of the offense and within the overall game plan, his numbers aren't bad. To me, that's as much on Coach Smith as it is on Miller.

I don't mean to use more selective stats here, but I think they are helpful to evaluate this issue. During the final 8 games of last season, which were arguably the most important/high pressure games of the year (@BSU, @CSU, Nevada, New Mexico, Conference Tournament, and NCAA Tournament), Miller averaged 3.8 three point attempts per game. That's more of a number I think we can all live with him shooting. Of those attempts, he made 40.7%.

How about this year? During Quadrant 1 games, Miller has averaged only 2.8 three point attempts per game and he has made 35.3% of them. Again, those numbers are more in line with what we can all live with. I would argue these numbers show Miller (1) is on a tighter leash during the "big games", whether that is coaching or self-imposed is unclear, but it is a good thing and (2) can be effective against strong teams and in big games (not only able to score against inferior teams, as some have suggested).

All of that being said, don't get me wrong here. I am as frustrated as the next fan when I see Miller jack up a 28 footer or attempt a huge Harden-like step back three. Those shots are not in his wheel house. But watch him when he shoots a three within the flow of the offense where he can step into the shot. He can and does make those shots. That's all I'm trying to say in this thread. He can shoot, but it needs to be the right kind of shot.
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