Turnovers, bad shots, horrible free throw shooting, lack of fundamentals - (hey Medlin, how about blocking out the shooter on the free throw?) - and most of all, just a lack of talent. These players are merely average. The most losses at home since 1995-1996. This is the year we look back on as the beginning of the "slide". Not sure what else to say.

Watch instead of listen . It was Berger that missed the block out


My point was you called out Medlin, but I saw it as Berger that screwed the block out.

I will agree with you FloridaAggie13, we are just average. Not sure about the beginning of the slide but I have listened to two Utah Sportscasters and they have said the same thing as you. Ben Bagely(a USU alum) said that not winning any NCAA games for Stew has finally caught up to him and he see's as our best years behind us no in head of us. Not sure what Bags meant by not winning any NCAA games has caught up with Stew? A sportscaster in St. Greed on sports radio 1210 said the same thing as Bagely, so only time will tell on that? I saw it happen to Dutch Belnap, also Rod Tuellar. Kohn never did have any good years!

WAAggie wrote:Watch instead of listen . It was Berger that missed the block out

I did watch.

troutputz wrote:I will agree with you FloridaAggie13, we are just average. Not sure about the beginning of the slide but I have listened to two Utah Sportscasters and they have said the same thing as you. Ben Bagely(a USU alum) said that not winning any NCAA games for Stew has finally caught up to him and he see's as our best years behind us no in head of us. Not sure what Bags meant by not winning any NCAA games has caught up with Stew? A sportscaster in St. Greed on sports radio 1210 said the same thing as Bagely, so only time will tell on that? I saw it happen to Dutch Belnap, also Rod Tuellar. Kohn never did have any good years!

Kohn lived of his resume of being a Bobby Knight disciple. He was an average coach with average teams.

I think what they mean by not winning NCAA games catching up with Stew is with some NCAA success we would be able to recruit some game changers. We are stuck in the same talent pool we've always been in and there isn't a lot of room for error when recruiting from that pond. We had some players like Wilkinson, JC Carroll and J. Quayle who were diamonds in the rough and that allowed our average players to just play a roll and not have to be playmakers. None of the players on this team are 'star' quality and should be roll players.

FloridaAggie13 wrote:Turnovers, bad shots, horrible free throw shooting, lack of fundamentals - (hey Medlin, how about blocking out the shooter on the free throw?) - and most of all, just a lack of talent. These players are merely average. The most losses at home since 1995-1996. This is the year we look back on as the beginning of the "slide". Not sure what else to say.

Agree with it all, except Berger needs to get some criticism for that offensive rebound as well.

FloridaAggie13 wrote: This is the year we look back on as the beginning of the "slide". Not sure what else to say.

You already said more than you know.
In the past 30+ years, (ignoring the KS years since I think the coach was the problem) we have had two BAD years. 81-82 we were 4-23. 98-99 we were 15-13. Those two years were followed by some of the most significant successes in program history. 82-83 we were 19-10 and received an at-large invite to a 48-team NCAA tournament. 99-00 we set a school record with 28 wins and had our only undefeated conference record. This year's team is better than either of those bad teams were. Tueller used JC transfers and a redshirt freshman named Greg Grant to blend with pretty non-descript players to turn things around. Stew used JC transfers to blend with Troy Rolle, Tony Brown and Dmitri Jorrsen to turn things around. So who do we have on this year's team that has shown promise to be a career impact player moving ahead? Could be that it is only Medlin, though I think Reed has more potential than any 81-82 player and suspect the same is true of others. Do we have anyone on the bench that could be significant? We won't see Shaw or Lopez push Greg Grant's numbers, but having two options at filling a major void is a good position. So the crux of the question is "How quickly can Davis and Bradshaw adjust to D-I?" We don't know. I'm just not ready to declare the beginning of a slide. Because if they do blend in well, we could well be on our way to a long streak of success - again.

FloridaAggie13 wrote:Turnovers, bad shots, horrible free throw shooting, lack of fundamentals - (hey Medlin, how about blocking out the shooter on the free throw?) - and most of all, just a lack of talent. These players are merely average. The most losses at home since 1995-1996. This is the year we look back on as the beginning of the "slide". Not sure what else to say.

Sorry Florida, I've seen you post this "slide" stuff a couple of times and you are waaaaaay off the mark. Generally I appreciate your posts, especially concerning football, but to take a really crappy season (by Aggie standards) and say that we are on a slide is quite a stretch. Maybe I misunderstand, and you mean we will start sliding up again next year???

I am not going to apologize for what I saw on the court today, but I don't believe for one millisecond that this will happen again next year. Not a very good team this year - I agree. It happens. Whoops. But then again I am incredibly disappointed in the Spectrum this year too.

Actually, I'm starting to blame myself for saying I'd trade some success in football for an off season in basketball. Sorry everyone

Not buying the "slide" either. I understand the frustration though. I also don't buy some douche saying the lack of NCAA wins catching up. I guess that's why NMSU has better recruits? Because they are going to the elite 8 every year? Or St. Mary's is doing so well this year because they keep dominating the NCAA tourny? These pundits are just trying to get reactions and for some reason a bunch of them like to take away from coaches of mid major teams - make sure you keep them on their place.

Bagley is one of the worst radio personalities I've heard in awhile. If you ever been forced to listen to him (I don't have satellite radio) you'll realize that all he does is pander to the more dominate host. He doesn't have his own opinions. Therefore his opinion is worthless.

On the game... Yes I was there... The Aggies played pretty well considering they were completely outmatched. NMSU was better. It was so hard for USU to get points. NMSU scored much easier. Longer, bigger, stronger. No, this doesn't explain all of the miscues at the end but they weren't going to win that game today. I was also at the LATECH game. While they looked to be more athletic, stronger, and longer as well they were not even close to as talented as NMSU. Because of these things I think Stew has done a great job this year. Don't blame this on recruiting either because it isn't the staff's fault that Arnold isn't here, or that Jardine is out, Walker flaked out, or that they graduated a ton of guys last year. This is college. You have goings and comings. There are many examples that from Majors to Mid-Majors.

On the Fans... if you're so disappointed, then get your butts to the games (I know all of you being so critical weren't there). Quit blaming the students. I thought the atmosphere was pretty good. Sure there were some empty seats but that comes with a .500 season and it happens EVERYWHERE. Don't be so naive. For the record, the noise level was pretty good by the way.

Season ticket holder for 10 years here. In the student section for 6 years before that while working on my degrees. I am at the games (thanks for your assurance that I'm not there though) and this is the worst student section I've seen in my 16 years. I wasn't being critical of the students, just pointing out the facts. I'm not sure how long you have been attending, but if it's been more than this year you would know this is the worst student section we've seen in a long time.

Well how in the world can my opinion matter when you are speaking in ABSOLUTE FACTS??? You win for sure.

Many (thats what I meant to say - I didn't mean to be so absolute - I apologize) have made comments about how things looked on TV - that was the purpose of my comments on the attendance issue. As SectionBAggie has pointed out above, there have been two bad years since 1980. That means you were only in attendance through one of those years. Since people tend to follow and support winners - the Aggie teams that you've followed have been easier to root for than this current team and the 98-99 team. This would make me believe that the student sections would also be better during the "good years" vs. the "bad years" (current year and 98-99).

What do you expect? The team isn't as good as it has been. People have become accustomed to better. The buzz in the spectrum isn't like it used to be and that cannot be artificially created by the fans only. The product on the court has to improve. Yeah, there is a great track record, but sometimes that works against you. I have no beef with the students. Win and they come. Struggle and they will struggle to support you.

So if this years Student Section is "worse" than it was in years 98-99 then by all means you've gotta be right. I'll definitely have to concede to your unquestioned wisdom because the truth is....You're older! Curse my parents!!!!!

Butler is 15-13. I suppose they are on the "slide" also? No! They lost everyone, just like us, and in a few years (possibly even next year) they will be back, and so will we. Hold on to your hats, it's going to be an up and down ride.

TrueBlueFan wrote:Butler is 15-13. I suppose they are on the "slide" also? No! They lost everyone, just like us, and in a few years (possibly even next year) they will be back, and so will we. Hold on to your hats, it's going to be an up and down ride.

I have all confidence in Stew and am not worried at all.

Chupamedia wrote:Season ticket holder for 10 years here. In the student section for 6 years before that while working on my degrees. I am at the games (thanks for your assurance that I'm not there though) and this is the worst student section I've seen in my 16 years. I wasn't being critical of the students, just pointing out the facts. I'm not sure how long you have been attending, but if it's been more than this year you would know this is the worst student section we've seen in a long time.

Agreed Chupa. I too hold season tickets (also for a while), and this year's students just don't get it. 1:00 start time hurt attendance today.

TrueBlueFan wrote:Butler is 15-13. I suppose they are on the "slide" also? No! They lost everyone, just like us, and in a few years (possibly even next year) they will be back, and so will we. Hold on to your hats, it's going to be an up and down ride.

Perhaps they are...Butler may just prove to have been a flash in the pan as they haven't had the long success USU has.

I'm really hoping next years recruits come in ready to play at a high level and I'm completely wrong about my 'slide' theory.

newtonianblue wrote:

FloridaAggie13 wrote:Turnovers, bad shots, horrible free throw shooting, lack of fundamentals - (hey Medlin, how about blocking out the shooter on the free throw?) - and most of all, just a lack of talent. These players are merely average. The most losses at home since 1995-1996. This is the year we look back on as the beginning of the "slide". Not sure what else to say.

Sorry Florida, I've seen you post this "slide" stuff a couple of times and you are waaaaaay off the mark. Generally I appreciate your posts, especially concerning football, but to take a really crappy season (by Aggie standards) and say that we are on a slide is quite a stretch. Maybe I misunderstand, and you mean we will start sliding up again next year???

I am not going to apologize for what I saw on the court today, but I don't believe for one millisecond that this will happen again next year. Not a very good team this year - I agree. It happens. Whoops. But then again I am incredibly disappointed in the Spectrum this year too.

Actually, I'm starting to blame myself for saying I'd trade some success in football for an off season in basketball. Sorry everyone

Man, I really hope the slide is "upwards" next year!

I'm just seeing a lot of things going on that are pointing in the wrong direction (in my opinion). Again, I hope I'm wrong. I love having a top-notch basketball team to root for from 2500 miles away.

This might be the wrong thread to post this thought, since there are so many doom and gloom, the sky is falling, the world is
coming to an end, Aggie basketball is dying, yadda yadda, yadda, threads on this forum, but here it is anyway. Nothing lasts
forever. What happened to the UCLA dynasty after Wooden left? What is Butler doing this year after two or three years of
success in the tourney? Stew has been telling us (for those who care to listen or those who attend his conferences and
luncheons) that we should expect a bad year. It appears beyond question that this is that year. Does that mean Stew
has lost it? That he no longer cares? That he has given up? None of the above. This is not a good year for USU basketball.
Our only chance to make it to the NCAA tourney is to win the WAC tourney, and I'll go on record right now to predict that
will not happen. OK. A down year. A blip. But no reason, IMO, to walk the plank, jump off the ledge. We'll be back.

IMO, the only reason UCLA isn't dominant in basketball every single year is that there are too many competing egos at that school. Their program needs a coach that can tell those other egos to back off and stuff it. A coach who takes charge with no need to apologize or compromise. They just don't have that.

Anytime you have a culture where everyone is trying to satisfy everyone, you get mediocre results. That's UCLA right now.

FloridaAggie13 wrote:

TrueBlueFan wrote:Butler is 15-13. I suppose they are on the "slide" also? No! They lost everyone, just like us, and in a few years (possibly even next year) they will be back, and so will we. Hold on to your hats, it's going to be an up and down ride.

Perhaps they are...Butler may just prove to have been a flash in the pan as they haven't had the long success USU has.

I'm really hoping next years recruits come in ready to play at a high level and I'm completely wrong about my 'slide' theory.

Butler a flash in the pan? I don't know how long of success you are implying, but since 97 Butler has won their conference regular season 10x, and their tournament 7x. They have been to the ncaa tournament almost every year since 97, and had multiple coaches leave for high profile jobs. They are far from a flash in the pan. Butler is what every mid major strives to be. A program that consistently wins, and wins big despite having coaches come and go. We have had great success with Stew and I am forever greatful that he is our coach, but we are nowhere near what Butler has been.

brownjeans wrote:IMO, the only reason UCLA isn't dominant in basketball every single year is that there are too many competing egos at that school. Their program needs a coach that can tell those other egos to back off and stuff it. A coach who takes charge with no need to apologize or compromise. They just don't have that.

Anytime you have a culture where everyone is trying to satisfy everyone, you get mediocre results. That's UCLA right now.

Ben Howland has been to the Final four 3x at ucla. They only went once before that since Wooden was the coach. Howland has done a great job there.

USUinventedswagger wrote:

FloridaAggie13 wrote:

TrueBlueFan wrote:Butler is 15-13. I suppose they are on the "slide" also? No! They lost everyone, just like us, and in a few years (possibly even next year) they will be back, and so will we. Hold on to your hats, it's going to be an up and down ride.

Perhaps they are...Butler may just prove to have been a flash in the pan as they haven't had the long success USU has.

I'm really hoping next years recruits come in ready to play at a high level and I'm completely wrong about my 'slide' theory.

Butler a flash in the pan? I don't know how long of success you are implying, but since 97 Butler has won their conference regular season 10x, and their tournament 7x. They have been to the ncaa tournament almost every year since 97, and had multiple coaches leave for high profile jobs. They are far from a flash in the pan. Butler is what every mid major strives to be. A program that consistently wins, and wins big despite having coaches come and go. We have had great success with Stew and I am forever greatful that he is our coach, but we are nowhere near what Butler has been.

Swagger, you are right, they (Butler) are not a flash in the pan. I was only looking at the last two years when they went to the finals and became recognized by everyone, not just hard-core basketball fans.

I would also concur this is not the start of a "slide" IF we had a couple of years of this, then yea, I buy it. When you have had as much success as we have had, then yea, anything more then 6 losses in a year is a big slide. Look the guys on this year team are not the finished product that we had last year. We don't recruit blue chippers like a Kentucky. We recruit players that we develop for a year or two, the problem is this team can't develop behind closed doors, instead they have to do it out in open for all of us to see. They can only get better. I think sometimes we forget how Spencer Nelson, Tony Brown, Nate Harris, even Tai and Jaycee were as freshman and sophomores. Were they as consistent as they were as junior and seniors? No! They developed into they players they became. And the same will happen with these players. Plus we have Stew who does more with less then any other coach I have seen. So yea it sucks, we are not good, but we don't have a history of a losing program. So trust the coach's to do their jobs, and we will avoid the so called "slide"

troutputz wrote:I will agree with you FloridaAggie13, we are just average. Not sure about the beginning of the slide but I have listened to two Utah Sportscasters and they have said the same thing as you. Ben Bagely(a USU alum) said that not winning any NCAA games for Stew has finally caught up to him and he see's as our best years behind us no in head of us. Not sure what Bags meant by not winning any NCAA games has caught up with Stew? A sportscaster in St. Greed on sports radio 1210 said the same thing as Bagely, so only time will tell on that? I saw it happen to Dutch Belnap, also Rod Tuellar. Kohn never did have any good years!

Bagely is a clown, and so is the St George local hosts. I've heard them and they are as clueless as they come. Not winning NCAA tournament games? You are still on that? Give it a rest. As a program we will be fine. Sorry, but twelve 23 win seasons in a row with ten of those teams having single digit losses is going to let me give Stew a mulligan.

How could this be the start of a slide? I think we've hit rock bottom. Like it's been said, if Davis and Bradshaw adjust fairly quickly to D-1 then we should be battling for 2nd place in the WAC easy! With Nevada being favorites again.

Alexb wrote:How could this be the start of a slide? I think we've hit rock bottom. Like it's been said, if Davis and Bradshaw adjust fairly quickly to D-1 then we should be battling for 2nd place in the WAC easy! With Nevada being favorites again.

We don't need to worry about Nevada next year since they will be in the MWC.

Usu is the favorite next year, with Denver and NMSU trying to replace some key pieces.

Alexb wrote:How could this be the start of a slide? I think we've hit rock bottom. Like it's been said, if Davis and Bradshaw adjust fairly quickly to D-1 then we should be battling for 2nd place in the WAC easy! With Nevada being favorites again.

Except Nevada is in the MW next year. They are doing what they need to be doing by winning the WAC before going to MW. I was in the student section and have no voice today so I did my part. I really hate whino marvin. I think I was yelling at him most of the game.

troutputz wrote:I will agree with you FloridaAggie13, we are just average. Not sure about the beginning of the slide but I have listened to two Utah Sportscasters and they have said the same thing as you. Ben Bagely(a USU alum) said that not winning any NCAA games for Stew has finally caught up to him and he see's as our best years behind us no in head of us. Not sure what Bags meant by not winning any NCAA games has caught up with Stew? A sportscaster in St. Greed on sports radio 1210 said the same thing as Bagely, so only time will tell on that? I saw it happen to Dutch Belnap, also Rod Tuellar. Kohn never did have any good years!

What? Did Stew, all of a sudden become stupid? Between you and florida, you would think that he doesn't have a brain in his head. With what he has done for usu, and this years because of some unforeseen cirumstances, he has an average team. The post area is down, and I think Pane has been poor. He played well for about 3/4 of the game, and then he tried to take over the game. A job he is not capable of doing. There are many of us who have been around even longer than you, and things seem to work out. Our players nest year will be better and oh bye the way, florida, it wasn't Medlin not covering the shooter.

hatescougars wrote:

troutputz wrote:I will agree with you FloridaAggie13, we are just average. Not sure about the beginning of the slide but I have listened to two Utah Sportscasters and they have said the same thing as you. Ben Bagely(a USU alum) said that not winning any NCAA games for Stew has finally caught up to him and he see's as our best years behind us no in head of us. Not sure what Bags meant by not winning any NCAA games has caught up with Stew? A sportscaster in St. Greed on sports radio 1210 said the same thing as Bagely, so only time will tell on that? I saw it happen to Dutch Belnap, also Rod Tuellar. Kohn never did have any good years!

What? Did Stew, all of a sudden become stupid? Between you and florida, you would think that he doesn't have a brain in his head. With what he has done for usu, and this years because of some unforeseen cirumstances, he has an average team. The post area is down, and I think Pane has been poor. He played well for about 3/4 of the game, and then he tried to take over the game. A job he is not capable of doing. There are many of us who have been around even longer than you, and things seem to work out. Our players nest year will be better and oh bye the way, florida, it wasn't Medlin not covering the shooter.

Please show me where I said Stew became stupid? In fact, in another post I said Stew's game plan and strategy is sound but the execution is the problem. As for the missed box out, maybe I'm wrong but I'd love to see another replay because what I (and both announcers) saw was Medlin stand in front of the shooter and not body up on him. But I guess because he's our best player I'm not allowed to point out that he made a mistake. Whether it was him or Berger doesn't matter; it is merely a symptom of what bad teams do. Would be nice to see them regroup and finish with a winning record.

Alexb wrote:How could this be the start of a slide? I think we've hit rock bottom. Like it's been said, if Davis and Bradshaw adjust fairly quickly to D-1 then we should be battling for 2nd place in the WAC easy! With Nevada being favorites again.

So if unproven freshmen can come in and kick some butt we'll be just fine...? This has been my point all along. We will again have young, untested players next year. Our saving grace could be that the WAC will not be a good basketball conference.

FloridaAggie13 wrote:

hatescougars wrote:

troutputz wrote:I will agree with you FloridaAggie13, we are just average. Not sure about the beginning of the slide but I have listened to two Utah Sportscasters and they have said the same thing as you. Ben Bagely(a USU alum) said that not winning any NCAA games for Stew has finally caught up to him and he see's as our best years behind us no in head of us. Not sure what Bags meant by not winning any NCAA games has caught up with Stew? A sportscaster in St. Greed on sports radio 1210 said the same thing as Bagely, so only time will tell on that? I saw it happen to Dutch Belnap, also Rod Tuellar. Kohn never did have any good years!

What? Did Stew, all of a sudden become stupid? Between you and florida, you would think that he doesn't have a brain in his head. With what he has done for usu, and this years because of some unforeseen cirumstances, he has an average team. The post area is down, and I think Pane has been poor. He played well for about 3/4 of the game, and then he tried to take over the game. A job he is not capable of doing. There are many of us who have been around even longer than you, and things seem to work out. Our players nest year will be better and oh bye the way, florida, it wasn't Medlin not covering the shooter.

Please show me where I said Stew became stupid? In fact, in another post I said Stew's game plan and strategy is sound but the execution is the problem. As for the missed box out, maybe I'm wrong but I'd love to see another replay because what I (and both announcers) saw was Medlin stand in front of the shooter and not body up on him. But I guess because he's our best player I'm not allowed to point out that he made a mistake. Whether it was him or Berger doesn't matter; it is merely a symptom of what bad teams do. Would be nice to see them regroup and finish with a winning record.

Berger had the shooter on that play. He attempted to block him out, but didn't quite get all the way in front of him. It was unlucky that the ball bounced to the opposite side of where Berger started. Medlin stood there and watched, and probably could've grabbed the ball after it was tipped, but he didn't go for it. Not sure why.

Both players were at fault, but it was Berger's job to box out the shooter. He tried and failed.

Seldomseensmith wrote:

Usu is the favorite next year

Why?

Here is the current Pomeroy ranking of next years WAC.

Denver82
NMSU 88
UT Arlington 97
USU 132
Idaho 169
LaTech215
Seattle 244
SJSU 265
UTSA 283
TxSt 286

Of the 3 teams that are better than USU, NMSU loses their 3 best players, Denver loses 3 of 7 rotation players, and Arlington Loses 3 of 7 rotation players. Idaho is losing 3 of 8 rotation players, including their starting backcourt. USU loses only 2 rotation players, and with all due respect to Pane, I think he is very replaceable in the Stew system.

In short, I think USU has less production to replace next year than anyone else.

justintime wrote:

Seldomseensmith wrote:

Usu is the favorite next year

Why?

Here is the current Pomeroy ranking of next years WAC.

Denver82
NMSU 88
UT Arlington 97
USU 132
Idaho 169
LaTech215
Seattle 244
SJSU 265
UTSA 283
TxSt 286

Of the 3 teams that are better than USU, NMSU loses their 3 best players, Denver loses 3 of 7 rotation players, and Arlington Loses 3 of 7 rotation players. Idaho is losing 3 of 8 rotation players, including their starting backcourt. USU loses only 2 rotation players, and with all due respect to Pane, I think he is very replaceable in the Stew system.

In short, I think USU has less production to replace next year than anyone else.

I agree. This reminds me of when we lost quayle. we need someone to step up, and i hope that is ej so we dont rely on a freshman.

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