History 2010 - Untold Truths

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History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by andytheaggie » August 28th, 2020, 7:34 pm

This is way cool. Education is the first step in solving the systemic racial issues plaguing our country. I'm proud of our football team for coming up with this great idea, and only wish this class had been offered while I was in school.



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by bigblue » August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm

I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by ProfessorChaos » August 29th, 2020, 12:35 am

Has any other university done something like this?! This feels quite groundbreaking/innovative!

I don't know if I've ever been more proud to be an Aggie!

:utah: :state: :rock:



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by FloridaAggie13 » August 29th, 2020, 7:12 am

ProfessorChaos wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 12:35 am
Has any other university done something like this?! This feels quite groundbreaking/innovative!

I don't know if I've ever been more proud to be an Aggie!

:utah: :state: :rock:
Yes, almost all universities have these types of courses. I imagine USU already did as well based on things I've read in the alumni magazine over the years.



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by cbingham » August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am

bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

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Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by OKAggie » August 29th, 2020, 8:11 am

cbingham wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
What on earth does that mean? Google doesn't know either : https://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ALe ... CAk&uact=5.


Nobody here knows anything.

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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by SaintAggie » August 29th, 2020, 8:22 am

cbingham wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
You are so virtuous. You must be. Only someone with a high level of virtue could identify another person as racist with so little evidence.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by 2004AG » August 29th, 2020, 8:47 am

cbingham wrote:
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
So you have to support burning down local businesses, support breaking into small businesses to steal TV’s and violence, or you’re racist against black people?


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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Aggie19 » August 29th, 2020, 8:55 am

SaintAggie wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 8:22 am
cbingham wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
You are so virtuous. You must be. Only someone with a high level of virtue could identify another person as racist with so little evidence.
A lot of different levels to this one. Perhaps he isn't racist, perhaps he's just making a simple statement that he just doesn't like looting and pillaging - he's pro small business, a small business lover as it were. So taken in a bubble, maybe not racist.

However, given the subject of the conversation and the history of this country, the comment is dripping with racist undertones and is ignorant at best and implies that minority protestors are all about looting and pillaging, when the vast majority are not. Not to even broach the subject of what you would do in the same situation after generations of racism against your people when you don't feel you have a voice. How long do they need to protest peacefully before something changes and people wake up to what's going on? Another 100 years, maybe 200? It's been 50+ years since Martin Luther King Jr was assassinated and were still having the same conversations.

Either way, I'm not seeing a call to violence against anyone and it was a statement that I don't feel was intended to be racist, but it's easy to see it being inturpreted that way.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Aggie84025 » August 29th, 2020, 10:02 am

cbingham wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
Your post is ridiculous. No one is saying we should be violent against minorities. Him saying he would take this over rioting and looting was spot on.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by FloridaAggie13 » August 29th, 2020, 11:03 am

Aggie84025 wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 10:02 am
cbingham wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
Your post is ridiculous. No one is saying we should be violent against minorities. Him saying he would take this over rioting and looting was spot on.
Conversely, the Marxist organization BLM is calling for violence against non-black people.

Sandbox.



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by ViAggie » August 29th, 2020, 11:04 am

bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

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BOOO take it to the sandbox


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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by FloridaAggie13 » August 29th, 2020, 11:04 am

cbingham wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 7:21 am
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
There was nothing racist in his comment.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by BleedAggieBlue0 » August 29th, 2020, 11:56 am

bigblue wrote:I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

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Completely unnecessary comment. Way to immediately ruin the thread.

“Proud of our players” would’ve worked just fine and not trashed the entire thread.
Does this sight have moderators still? Can we do something about more quickly deleting comments or moving threads to the sandbox?


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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by bigblue » August 29th, 2020, 1:47 pm


cbingham wrote:
bigblue wrote:
August 28th, 2020, 8:47 pm
I'll take this over looting and pillaging small businesses.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk
Similarly, I’d nominally take your comment over an overtly racist comment and a call for violence against minorities but not by much.

You can’t support the team if you don’t support the people. Your reaction of ossicle aggression is part of the problem. Please embrace anti-racism... not enough to just not be racist.
Or you can just ignore my comment all together. Never intended for it to blow the thread up. I can throw my support behind whomever I want. If embracing anti-racism means being destructive towards innocent people then that is something I just cannot support. Don't get me wrong I'm sympathetic for what the peaceful protestors are speaking out about, but that don't mean we get to dismiss the groups within the protests that are being destructive. And that's all I'm going to say about that.

Back to the OP, I do think this class is a great idea. Anywhere where you can facilitate deeper discussions well make everyone come out a deeper perspective on race.

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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Aggie formerly in Hawaii » August 29th, 2020, 2:45 pm

I told myself I wasnt going to get into sandbox type discussions again for a while. I will say ross Peterson is a great man and all aggies could learn a lot from him.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by BigSkyAG » August 29th, 2020, 3:22 pm

From a life lesson standpoint, the two best classes I took as an undergrad in the early 90's were from F. Ross and Michael L Nichols. In those courses we studied McCarthyism and Salem Mass. in 1692. In both of those situations all someone had to do was accuse you of witchcraft or ties to communism and you were immediately facing death or at least public shame. The result was that many made false confessions in an attempt to avoid death or shame. It wasn't until people stood up and refused to make false confessions of guilt that the situation stopped. In a similar way, many in the BLM organization have outlined what you need to do to prove that you are not racist. If you don't march, tweet enough, agree with their platform then you are racist. In the words of Rudy Gobert "If you don't agree with BLM, then maybe you shouldn't watch us."
Jason Whitlock (a respected journalist who is black) writes a fantastic article on why BLM does nothing for the African American cause. The point of this rant is to show that you can disagree with BLM and still support African Americans, especially our athletes at USU. I trust that F. Ross will discuss racism in our country and point out the many success stories that we have had at USU. Good for him and Gary!
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by taniataylor » August 29th, 2020, 4:25 pm

I am very proud of the boys & Coach A for initiating this.

As far as “preferring it over looting & pillaging”, not necessarily a bad comment but maybe not completely appropriate for the moment. Maybe something a little more like “Im glad our boys chose to educate themselves as well as others on this subject instead of falling to the negativity around them and lashing out out of frustration” would be better.
These are very hard times for everyone and for the Aggie athletes, can be very hard to relate to their surroundings.
About 2 years ago, at family day, a certain player that I know, took pictures with and signed posters & t-shirts for a family, said athlete, on another day, saw the Mom and one son of the same “family day” family at Walmart and after trying to give a fist bump to the child, the the child was told to stay away from said athlete. Maybe they didnt recognize my favorite person, but he sure didnt like that feeling
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by oleblu111 » August 29th, 2020, 4:40 pm

taniataylor wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 4:25 pm
I am very proud of the boys & Coach A for initiating this.

As far as “preferring it over looting & pillaging”, not necessarily a bad comment but maybe not completely appropriate for the moment. Maybe something a little more like “Im glad our boys chose to educate themselves as well as others on this subject instead of falling to the negativity around them and lashing out out of frustration” would be better.
These are very hard times for everyone and for the Aggie athletes, can be very hard to relate to their surroundings.
About 2 years ago, at family day, a certain player that I know, took pictures with and signed posters & t-shirts for a family, said athlete, on another day, saw the Mom and one son of the same “family day” family at Walmart and after trying to give a fist bump to the child, the the child was told to stay away from said athlete. Maybe they didnt recognize my favorite person, but he sure didnt like that feeling
Very good post, Tania and I have close relatives that are not white, and there are people that do things that are very hurtful, some I doubt even know what they are doing. My Daughter's family has been able to succeed so far because of their family strength with a father that is a great person very cool and a great teacher. Two are about to graduate from college and the other one is a honor student. Let me say they are much better at handling that B.S. than what I'am.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Aggie84025 » August 29th, 2020, 4:52 pm

Awesone job by the players, gary and professor Peterson. No doubt this will help lead a positive change. We have some great kids in the program that want to have a positive impact in their communities.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by newhouse9 » August 29th, 2020, 8:02 pm

taniataylor wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 4:25 pm
I am very proud of the boys & Coach A for initiating this.

As far as “preferring it over looting & pillaging”, not necessarily a bad comment but maybe not completely appropriate for the moment. Maybe something a little more like “Im glad our boys chose to educate themselves as well as others on this subject instead of falling to the negativity around them and lashing out out of frustration” would be better.
These are very hard times for everyone and for the Aggie athletes, can be very hard to relate to their surroundings.
About 2 years ago, at family day, a certain player that I know, took pictures with and signed posters & t-shirts for a family, said athlete, on another day, saw the Mom and one son of the same “family day” family at Walmart and after trying to give a fist bump to the child, the the child was told to stay away from said athlete. Maybe they didnt recognize my favorite person, but he sure didnt like that feeling
Amen.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Coloraggie » August 31st, 2020, 3:39 pm

taniataylor wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 4:25 pm
I am very proud of the boys & Coach A for initiating this.

As far as “preferring it over looting & pillaging”, not necessarily a bad comment but maybe not completely appropriate for the moment. Maybe something a little more like “Im glad our boys chose to educate themselves as well as others on this subject instead of falling to the negativity around them and lashing out out of frustration” would be better.
These are very hard times for everyone and for the Aggie athletes, can be very hard to relate to their surroundings.
About 2 years ago, at family day, a certain player that I know, took pictures with and signed posters & t-shirts for a family, said athlete, on another day, saw the Mom and one son of the same “family day” family at Walmart and after trying to give a fist bump to the child, the the child was told to stay away from said athlete. Maybe they didnt recognize my favorite person, but he sure didnt like that feeling
Tania, thanks for the post, I do like your suggestion for what he could have said and I appreciate your calm steady demeanor. I think I know how your favorite player felt in that moment. One year I was asked to play Santa Claus at our local church christmas party. It was fun. Lots of little kids wanted to come up and give me hugs and loved me. The next day at church I saw one of the kids and said hi and got a total look of disgust. In my case the costume made all the difference, without it I was a random stranger. I'm glad I don't have to go through that often. I hope Jordan doesn't deal with it often and I'm sorry he had to even once. I think most people aren't like that and I'm sad that there are a few who give the rest a bad name. A few bad cops give good cops a bad name. A few rioters give peaceful protesters a bad name. With all going on I often remind myself and my family to look at individuals and not classes of people. Best of luck to you and Jordan.



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by brownjeans » August 31st, 2020, 3:57 pm

I remember taking a women's studies class about the portrayal of women in the media. It examined the way women are portrayed in ads, movies, print, etc., and discussed studies relating to the effects media portrayals of women have on women and girls. It wasn't anti-patriarchy, it acknowledged that the portrayal of women is more complex than blaming men.

When I think back on my time in school, only a handful of classes transformed my mind and caused me to view the world differently than I did before the class. This was one of those classes.

I imagine this Untold Truths class would be similarly eye-opening. I wish I were in Logan and could audit it.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by oleblu111 » September 2nd, 2020, 2:08 pm

There is a very good T.V.show out produced by Shaq that tells the story and history of Watts and the changes that have taken place in that area since the riots. If memory serves it is called a week in Watts.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by hipsterdoofus21 » September 3rd, 2020, 1:39 pm

oleblu111 wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 4:40 pm
taniataylor wrote:
August 29th, 2020, 4:25 pm
I am very proud of the boys & Coach A for initiating this.

As far as “preferring it over looting & pillaging”, not necessarily a bad comment but maybe not completely appropriate for the moment. Maybe something a little more like “Im glad our boys chose to educate themselves as well as others on this subject instead of falling to the negativity around them and lashing out out of frustration” would be better.
These are very hard times for everyone and for the Aggie athletes, can be very hard to relate to their surroundings.
About 2 years ago, at family day, a certain player that I know, took pictures with and signed posters & t-shirts for a family, said athlete, on another day, saw the Mom and one son of the same “family day” family at Walmart and after trying to give a fist bump to the child, the the child was told to stay away from said athlete. Maybe they didnt recognize my favorite person, but he sure didnt like that feeling
Very good post, Tania and I have close relatives that are not white, and there are people that do things that are very hurtful, some I doubt even know what they are doing. My Daughter's family has been able to succeed so far because of their family strength with a father that is a great person very cool and a great teacher. Two are about to graduate from college and the other one is a honor student. Let me say they are much better at handling that B.S. than what I'am.
Tania does have a calming presence on this board.

I think this course idea by the players is exactly what this country needs. You can't solve a disagreement by digging in further on your side of the argument. Both sides need to seek better understanding of the other's viewpoint. That's only going to be done through open and honest conversation from both sides, and then together coming to an agreement about how best to approach the subject going forward. Clearly many black Americans have deep rooted and unresolved feelings about their history and their place in America. This class is a great opportunity for all students to learn historical truths and understand why certain aspects of American life today may be sensitive for the black community.

I say all students, because right now everyone is relying way too much on media, activists, celebrities, and politicians to feed them truths and all four of those sources come with certain biases. The goal of the class should be to restore conviction in the American dream. Understanding of the perfect ideals the country was founded and built on, but also how the country hasn't always lived up to them. In the end, students should come away instilled with confidence that progress has been made in certain areas and hope that further progress can be made in others by better understanding these American ideals.

I would also recommend students complete a number of hours outside the classroom shadowing police officers so there's better understanding of life in law enforcement. You can't truly see the viewpoint of the officer from a bystanders cellphone. or even body cams. Ride alongs would also give both sides the opportunity to talk about the conflicts that may arise and to share viewpoints.

For the record, I'm also not in favor of rioting, looting, or cancel culture and strongly feel the "woke" groups participating in these acts do not represent black or white Americans. They are selfish, angry individuals who are only seeking power and profit for their particular faction under the cloak of virtuous causes. They are kids throwing massive tantrums and it's time for them to go to bed so the adults in the room can talk and hash out the issues. This proposed history class is a great setting for these discussions to start.
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Jjoey52 » September 3rd, 2020, 3:17 pm

Ifthisisot Sandboxmateria I don’t know what is.


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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by taniataylor » September 3rd, 2020, 4:17 pm

Jjoey52 wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 3:17 pm
Ifthisisot Sandboxmateria I don’t know what is.
:anonymous:
Well the class was KINDA created by football players and the football coach....

I think I read, “if this is not Sandbox material” :lol:
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Aggie formerly in Hawaii » September 4th, 2020, 9:55 am

Jjoey52 wrote:
September 3rd, 2020, 3:17 pm
Ifthisisot Sandboxmateria I don’t know what is.
It is literally dealing with the players on the football team meeting with a professor who used to have an office in the Spectrum and has been involved with Aggie athletics for decades.



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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by USU78 » September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am

"Untold."

🙄


You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Dwigt » September 4th, 2020, 11:55 am

USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am
"Untold."

🙄
How old were you when you first learned about the Tulsa massacre?


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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by USU78 » September 4th, 2020, 2:22 pm

Dwigt wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 11:55 am
USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am
"Untold."

🙄
How old were you when you first learned about the Tulsa massacre?
How old were you when you learned about the Haun's Mill Massacre? How old were you when you learned about the Clay County Election Battle? How old were you when you learned about the cannonade of Nauvoo? How old were you when you learned about the US Expeditionary Force's invasion into Utah Territory?

In answer to your inapposite question: probably mid twenties. Maybe later. Don't specifically recall. It might even have been in elementary school.
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by brownjeans » September 4th, 2020, 10:25 pm

USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am
"Untold."

🙄
Perhaps you should consider taking the class to see if you learn something that wasn't previously "told" to you. Or perhaps you feel you know it all - and so does everyone else? That what they will teach is common knowledge?
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by Dwigt » September 4th, 2020, 10:44 pm

USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 2:22 pm
Dwigt wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 11:55 am
USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am
"Untold."

🙄
How old were you when you first learned about the Tulsa massacre?
How old were you when you learned about the Haun's Mill Massacre? How old were you when you learned about the Clay County Election Battle? How old were you when you learned about the cannonade of Nauvoo? How old were you when you learned about the US Expeditionary Force's invasion into Utah Territory?

In answer to your inapposite question: probably mid twenties. Maybe later. Don't specifically recall. It might even have been in elementary school.
This is the most hateful way someone has told me to go to the Telestial Kingdom.


"The threshold of insult is in direct relation to intelligence and security." John Steinbeck

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USU78
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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by USU78 » September 4th, 2020, 11:05 pm

brownjeans wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:25 pm
USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am
"Untold."

🙄
Perhaps you should consider taking the class to see if you learn something that wasn't previously "told" to you. Or perhaps you feel you know it all - and so does everyone else? That what they will teach is common knowledge?
"Untold." Whenever I've seen it employed it's inevitably warmed over same old same old, but with a hook to get the lookyloo inside the tent door.

Marketing.

Race issues have taken an inordinate amount of bandwidth during my lifetime. I'm exhausted by the inexhaustible outrage. I've never done a d@mned thing to anybody. But because I look like I do and have the antecedents I do, I am unjustly judged. Inevitably.

And so are you.

Not a single thing makes a bit of difference.

My grandchildren are the great, great, great, great grandchildren of the Civil War generation, and I am furious that they, my children, and I are deemed guilty by birth of sins committed in the now hoary past by today's moral monsters. It is an outrageous immorality.

That is what oughta be being taught. And that will certainly be ignored in this and any other supposed expose on the "untold" story of the excesses ensuing from the malsteps of Reconstruction.

So forgive my eyeroll. Can't help seeing this as just another futility (if not cynical manipulation). Vanitas vanitatum!
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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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Re: History 2010 - Untold Truths

Post by USU78 » September 4th, 2020, 11:08 pm

Dwigt wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:44 pm
USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 2:22 pm
Dwigt wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 11:55 am
USU78 wrote:
September 4th, 2020, 10:07 am
"Untold."

🙄
How old were you when you first learned about the Tulsa massacre?
How old were you when you learned about the Haun's Mill Massacre? How old were you when you learned about the Clay County Election Battle? How old were you when you learned about the cannonade of Nauvoo? How old were you when you learned about the US Expeditionary Force's invasion into Utah Territory?

In answer to your inapposite question: probably mid twenties. Maybe later. Don't specifically recall. It might even have been in elementary school.
This is the most hateful way someone has told me to go to the Telestial Kingdom.
Then mind yer manners. If thou prickst me, do I not prick back?


You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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