dyedblue wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 2:55 pm

Does it also account for other D1 programs? We have three on the wasatch front as well as two more that play D1 basketball. There are probably not very many markets in the west with that kind of saturation.


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100 mile radius would not include Utah County. So that eliminates Byu-provo sports. But your point is well taken, we have a lot of extra competitors for our population size

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 10:03 am

That Wyoming game deserved much better attendance. Sure, it was in November, but the weather was great that day and that was an afternoon game. BYU and Boise St not being sell outs was disappointing, but not even the student turnout for the Wyoming game was very good.

And the Wyoming game was when the scanners were down, so the reported number (16,304) seemed VERY low. With that one data point being closer to the ~21,000 that were actually there, we may have been higher than UNLV. Regardless, there is plenty of room for improvement.

Aggie19 wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:01 pm

dyedblue wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 2:55 pm

Does it also account for other D1 programs? We have three on the wasatch front as well as two more that play D1 basketball. There are probably not very many markets in the west with that kind of saturation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

100 mile radius would not include Utah County. So that eliminates Byu-provo sports. But your point is well taken, we have a lot of extra competitors for our population size

Lets face it, Logan is a pain to get to. There are 4 main ways into the valley: Highway 89 from Sardine Canyon, the road from Tremonton, Highway 89 from Preston, and Logan Canyon. Sardine Canyon absolutely sucks to drive in late October-November. There aren't a lot of people out towards Tremonton. Same with Preston. There is nobody to even come through Logan Canyon.
So there is really only one direction people will be coming from outside the valley, which from the Wasatch Front. The drive to Logan feels more like a journey to the Mount Erebor than just a drive to a football game. We have to do something to convince people that it is worth making that trip to support the team. I have no idea what it is. Funnel cakes sound like a great idea.

NAggsty Butler wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:18 pm

Lets face it, Logan is a pain to get to. There are 4 main ways into the valley: Highway 89 from Sardine Canyon, the road from Tremonton, Highway 89 from Preston, and Logan Canyon. Sardine Canyon absolutely sucks to drive in late October-November. There aren't a lot of people out towards Tremonton. Same with Preston. There is nobody to even come through Logan Canyon.
So there is really only one direction people will be coming from outside the valley, which from the Wasatch Front. The drive to Logan feels more like a journey to the Mount Erebor than just a drive to a football game. We have to do something to convince people that it is worth making that trip to support the team. I have no idea what it is. Funnel cakes sound like a great idea.

Hyperloop.

If one really wants to face facts about USU alums in Salt Lake area, you could use the beehive classic basketball game as a example of alums that do not care about USU after leaving, of all the schools that play in it you would think out of town alums from USU would welcome a chance to watch the school play without a trip thru sardine, but that classic is not well attended by USU folks at all.

We even played Memphis in football years ago at Rice stadium that game was poorly attended. I think the school over the years has made a great effort to involve alums down there with little success.

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 4:02 pm

If one really wants to face facts about USU alums in Salt Lake area, you could use the beehive classic basketball game as a example of alums that do not care about USU after leaving, of all the schools that play in it you would think out of town alums from USU would welcome a chance to watch the school play without a trip thru sardine, but that classic is not well attended by USU folks at all.

We even played Memphis in football years ago at Rice stadium that game was poorly attended. I think the school over the years has made a great effort to involve alums down there with little success.

It would be interesting to see a study that showed where alums end up. It seems to me that a large number of alums, or at least in my field(Engineering) end up out of state. Maybe there just aren't that many alums along the Wasatch Front?

NAggsty Butler wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:18 pm

Lets face it, Logan is a pain to get to. There are 4 main ways into the valley: Highway 89 from Sardine Canyon, the road from Tremonton, Highway 89 from Preston, and Logan Canyon. Sardine Canyon absolutely sucks to drive in late October-November. There aren't a lot of people out towards Tremonton. Same with Preston. There is nobody to even come through Logan Canyon.
So there is really only one direction people will be coming from outside the valley, which from the Wasatch Front. The drive to Logan feels more like a journey to the Mount Erebor than just a drive to a football game. We have to do something to convince people that it is worth making that trip to support the team. I have no idea what it is. Funnel cakes sound like a great idea.

This seems like a criticism from the 80’s early 90’s. Sardine canyon is a better drive than Parley’s Canyon and doesn’t have a rush hour. The problem is Logan is colder than Salt Lake.

brownjeans wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 10:07 am

JFW_AGGIES wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 9:16 am

dyedblue wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:16 am

I didn’t have time to do all of them, but a Fresno filled up 77.5% of their stadium and only 5% of their population attended games.

We filled up 76.9% of our games and 38% of Logan’s population attended games.

Is cut to throw out numbers like that, but given the size of Logan there is pretty darn good support. Room for growth of course, but I think we do okay.

we need to quit using this metric as we all know a lot of USU's fans that a attend games come from SLC and the other side of the mountains.

Seems relevant to me. I mean, how far from Logan do you have to go before you have a circle that contains a population of 2 million people? How far for Fresno, UNLV, San Diego. I mean, some comparisons just aren't the same - I learned that from Sesame Street.

It is absolutely relevant. I've said it over and over like a broken record but the stadium, like every other stadium ever built, had a design capacity based on the population that it serves. As of last year Cache County has 120k. Yes, many fans travel from other counties in the state or neighboring states but the population of a county where a stadium resides is a good indicator of how many people it serves. There are exceptions like Hawaii and Wyoming where the stadium serves a fan base made up of the entire state since they are in areas without competition and the schools market themselves as representatives of the entire state. Fans of other schools also travel from outside the county that their respective school is in but using a county population still serves as a good comparison to measure how well a fan base supports their team.

We could average a sellout at 25k and still appear in the middle of the MWC. Something tells me that even that would not stop all the ridiculous comparisons with these raw attendance numbers. All we would hear is how BYU gets 55k+, what is wrong with USU?

The numbers mean ZERO. The numbers aren't even counted or reported with the same accuracy or criteria from school to school. There's not any way on earth that UNLV averaged 19k when they haven't had even a single game all season where Sam Boyd was half full. CSU and AFA? those are joke numbers, those stadiums have been left empty all season. Then there's SJSU...LMAO. There's no way that stadium had a capacity of 30k before renovations began - it was smaller than old Romney (before upgrades) but let's just assume for a moment that it did hold 30k. They have half of their stadium stands removed this season for renovation - a tarp or some green carpet or something was spread over it. So without that half what is the capacity of the remaining stadium? Well, this report shows they averaged over 15k this season! Must have been packed to standing room only all season right? - oh,.....except it wasn't. It was the same pathetic 3-4k spread around what was left of the stadium.

Point is, don't read anything into these supposed "attendance" numbers.

BigBlueDart wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:48 pm

NAggsty Butler wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:18 pm

Lets face it, Logan is a pain to get to. There are 4 main ways into the valley: Highway 89 from Sardine Canyon, the road from Tremonton, Highway 89 from Preston, and Logan Canyon. Sardine Canyon absolutely sucks to drive in late October-November. There aren't a lot of people out towards Tremonton. Same with Preston. There is nobody to even come through Logan Canyon.
So there is really only one direction people will be coming from outside the valley, which from the Wasatch Front. The drive to Logan feels more like a journey to the Mount Erebor than just a drive to a football game. We have to do something to convince people that it is worth making that trip to support the team. I have no idea what it is. Funnel cakes sound like a great idea.

Hyperloop.

Having seasons that resemble 2018 relatively frequently with NONE that resemble 2016, combined with a hyperloop and funnel cakes would probably do the trick.

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 4:02 pm

If one really wants to face facts about USU alums in Salt Lake area, you could use the beehive classic basketball game as a example of alums that do not care about USU after leaving, of all the schools that play in it you would think out of town alums from USU would welcome a chance to watch the school play without a trip thru sardine, but that classic is not well attended by USU folks at all.

We even played Memphis in football years ago at Rice stadium that game was poorly attended. I think the school over the years has made a great effort to involve alums down there with little success.

Using the Beehive Classic, the entire Ute fan base care even less about their team. Also, the last time USU played Memphis was in the 70’s. Your data doesn’t support the narrative that alums don’t care about about USU. Further, you should probably separate the University from the Athletic Department.

NavyBlueAggie wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 9:36 am

2004AG wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:22 am

We kinda got screwed with 3 November games and the Colorado State and Nevada games had bad luck with the weather in October.

Boy, ain't that the truth 2004AG ....November night games in Logan... turn on the T V baby. What could the MWC possibly be thinking to schedule so many game in November in Logan Utah? The drive back to Sandy after midnight can be a test, even for me.

I cannot figure out why the MW cannot schedule more November games in Hawaii, Sn Diego and Las Vegas. The weather is decent, plus it is earlier. The argument can also be be made somewhat for San Jose, Fresno and Reno. It is ridiculous for 3 November games in Logan.

Full wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 4:08 pm

NAggsty Butler wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:18 pm

Lets face it, Logan is a pain to get to. There are 4 main ways into the valley: Highway 89 from Sardine Canyon, the road from Tremonton, Highway 89 from Preston, and Logan Canyon. Sardine Canyon absolutely sucks to drive in late October-November. There aren't a lot of people out towards Tremonton. Same with Preston. There is nobody to even come through Logan Canyon.
So there is really only one direction people will be coming from outside the valley, which from the Wasatch Front. The drive to Logan feels more like a journey to the Mount Erebor than just a drive to a football game. We have to do something to convince people that it is worth making that trip to support the team. I have no idea what it is. Funnel cakes sound like a great idea.

This seems like a criticism from the 80’s early 90’s. Sardine canyon is a better drive than Parley’s Canyon and doesn’t have a rush hour. The problem is Logan is colder than Salt Lake.

The problem is that the alumni from the 80's and 90's still think of Sardine Canyon and the football team as the 80's and 90's quality. They were the people who, when our team totally sucked, said "Well I didn't go to USU for the football anyway." They won't drive up Sardine Canyon because they don't think it is worth the effort. It doesn't matter how well the football team does right now, we lost those alumni after decades of poor performance and it will take decades of good performance to get them back.

I would be willing to bet that most of our fanbase is younger, and doesn't remember the 80's and 90's. The majority of their time as alumni has been the last decade where we have been very successful. Those fans will stick around. The older(and smaller) part of our fanbase was dedicated to the team, regardless of how bad we were. They were the ones who were willing to make the drive through 80's and 90's Sardine Canyon to watch us get blown out by BYU and Utah. They are a special group. If we can sustain our success for another decade then I think we will see our presence on the Wasatch Front grow a lot.

Full wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 4:22 pm

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 4:02 pm

If one really wants to face facts about USU alums in Salt Lake area, you could use the beehive classic basketball game as a example of alums that do not care about USU after leaving, of all the schools that play in it you would think out of town alums from USU would welcome a chance to watch the school play without a trip thru sardine, but that classic is not well attended by USU folks at all.

We even played Memphis in football years ago at Rice stadium that game was poorly attended. I think the school over the years has made a great effort to involve alums down there with little success.

Using the Beehive Classic, the entire Ute fan base care even less about their team. Also, the last time USU played Memphis was in the 70’s. Your data doesn’t support the narrative that alums don’t care about about USU. Further, you should probably separate the University from the Athletic Department.

I'm not concerned about the Ute fan base, however they do not have to travel 80 miles in the winter to watch the Utes play, so a game with a instate rival in the aggie alums back yard should be interesting for them, but it is not. I always hear from S.L. alums how they wish they could watch aggie basketball without tough drive in the winter to get to the Spectrum. My post was made on the aggie athletic board so I assumed it did not need cover other university alum functions.

NavyBlueAggie wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 9:36 am

2004AG wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:22 am

We kinda got screwed with 3 November games and the Colorado State and Nevada games had bad luck with the weather in October.

Boy, ain't that the truth 2004AG ....November night games in Logan... turn on the T V baby. What could the MWC possibly be thinking to schedule so many game in November in Logan Utah? The drive back to Sandy after midnight can be a test, even for me.

They are thinking that it is very important to keep the BSU train going. (and what was Boise thinking the other day playing in black unis and giving up the blue on blue field advantage vs. Hawaii?)

Until attendance is counted uniformly, these numbers don’t mean anything.


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2004AG wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:45 pm

Until attendance is counted uniformly, these numbers don’t mean anything.

This.

If one team counts actual attendance and another counts tickets sold, the two cannot be compared. In other words, if all schools are counting actual attendance, like we do, we're not 9th.

bluegrouse wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:40 pm

dyedblue wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:16 am

I didn’t have time to do all of them, but a Fresno filled up 77.5% of their stadium and only 5% of their population attended games.

We filled up 76.9% of our games and 38% of Logan’s population attended games.

Is cut to throw out numbers like that, but given the size of Logan there is pretty darn good support. Room for growth of course, but I think we do okay.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Meaningless to consider percentages. Useless metric except to try to make ourselves feel better. It’s like patting us on the back for a participation trophy.

Cold truth is we’re are 9th in the conference and it doesn’t matter if that is butts in seats or tickets sold. Equals same amount of money to the program either way.

No it doesn’t.
Many of these universities are buying their own tickets to game the numbers!!!!!

bluegrouse wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:44 pm

NAggsty Butler wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:18 pm

Aggie19 wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 3:01 pm

dyedblue wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 2:55 pm

Does it also account for other D1 programs? We have three on the wasatch front as well as two more that play D1 basketball. There are probably not very many markets in the west with that kind of saturation.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

100 mile radius would not include Utah County. So that eliminates Byu-provo sports. But your point is well taken, we have a lot of extra competitors for our population size

Lets face it, Logan is a pain to get to. There are 4 main ways into the valley: Highway 89 from Sardine Canyon, the road from Tremonton, Highway 89 from Preston, and Logan Canyon. Sardine Canyon absolutely sucks to drive in late October-November. There aren't a lot of people out towards Tremonton. Same with Preston. There is nobody to even come through Logan Canyon.
So there is really only one direction people will be coming from outside the valley, which from the Wasatch Front. The drive to Logan feels more like a journey to the Mount Erebor than just a drive to a football game. We have to do something to convince people that it is worth making that trip to support the team. I have no idea what it is. Funnel cakes sound like a great idea.

Stop. I live in downtown SLC and can be to Logan in an hour and 15 minutes and the stadium/spectrum in 1.5. It’s a ridiculously easy drive.

Sure, it's 1.5 hours on a good day. Throw in rush hour/game day traffic and it can easily be 2.5 hours. On game day, it can take 30 minutes just to get from the stadium to 300 South. Add snow, and the drive through Sardine can drop to 25 miles an hour. Throw in kids fighting in the backseat for an hour and a half, and you have a painful drive.

Don't get me wrong, I drive to Utah from Western Washington(14 hour drive with kids) multiple times a year, and when I lived in Logan, driving 1.5 hours to visit family became routine and driving doesn't bother me much at all. But we aren't talking about you and me. We aren't talking about the fans who are willing to make the drive rain or shine to watch their Aggies. Pretty much everyone on this board is willing to make the drive. But that's because we aren't casual fans. We already get all those people to the games. And it isn't enough. We are talking about the people who don't come to the games. The average person from Ogden south to Utah Valley views Logan as being in a different country. You talk to people about coming up and they look at you like you are asking them to rip their own arm off. These are people for who a 45 minute drive somewhere is the longest drive they have taken in years. They don't like to get out of their comfort zone. The Wasatch Front is where civilization is, and Logan is a frontier town, where they aren't sure if people even have electricity. In the 12 years that I lived in Logan I couldn't convince anyone to come up. They all responded like it was this huge journey that they would have to get a hotel to spend the night and pack sleeping bags and whatever. These are the people we have to convince to come, because we are already getting the people who are willing to make the drive. Somehow you have to convince them to make the drive that they see as a huge journey. I don't know how to do that.

2004AG wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:45 pm

Until attendance is counted uniformly, these numbers don’t mean anything.


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That is true attendance is not counted the same, however revenue from ticket sales for all athletic events finds USU in 11th place in the MWC,, per USA today.

I haven't done the research yet, but where does Maverik line up relative to the capacity for the other stadiums in the conference? Would we still be 9th or lower?

newhouse9 wrote: ↑

December 12th, 2019, 10:30 am

I haven't done the research yet, but where does Maverik line up relative to the capacity for the other stadiums in the conference? Would we still be 9th or lower?

We're dead last in seating capacity.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountai ... Conference

What is the schedule for capacity upgrades? Wasn't there supposed to be something happening to the South Endzone and East side?

oleblu111 wrote:

2004AG wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:45 pm

Until attendance is counted uniformly, these numbers don’t mean anything.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is true attendance is not counted the same, however revenue from ticket sales for all athletic events finds USU in 11th place in the MWC,, per USA today.

And yet not even that is counted uniformly.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thanks.

NAggsty Butler wrote: ↑

December 12th, 2019, 11:01 am

What is the schedule for capacity upgrades? Wasn't there supposed to be something happening to the South Endzone and East side?

I'd be opposed to any further expansion until we can fill the capacity we have.

2004AG wrote: ↑

December 12th, 2019, 11:06 am

oleblu111 wrote:

2004AG wrote: ↑

December 11th, 2019, 8:45 pm

Until attendance is counted uniformly, these numbers don’t mean anything.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is true attendance is not counted the same, however revenue from ticket sales for all athletic events finds USU in 11th place in the MWC,, per USA today.

And yet not even that is counted uniformly.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Why do you feel that is the case with the way USA today has it broken down ?

Seems like There is a lack of e interest in the entire community. It doesn’t even seem like game day is on a lot of people’s minds at businesses, hotel, restaurants etc. A lot of fans are probably watching the red school down the road on a year like this. winning does seem to cure a lot of problems. I would like to just see more of an energetic exciting environment in the stadium regardless of how many people

Whatley_posse wrote: ↑

December 12th, 2019, 3:22 pm

Seems like There is a lack of e interest in the entire community. It doesn’t even seem like game day is on a lot of people’s minds at businesses, hotel, restaurants etc. A lot of fans are probably watching the red school down the road on a year like this. winning does seem to cure a lot of problems. I would like to just see more of an energetic exciting environment in the stadium regardless of how many people

Go to Missoula, Montana on day when the FCS Grizzlies play and there is so much more hype and excitement than anything USU can muster. We're not even close. Most striking is how the business community get behind the Griz. In Logan, it is almost like the games are mostly tolerated and that is about it.

NavyBlue wrote: ↑

December 13th, 2019, 8:55 am

Whatley_posse wrote: ↑

December 12th, 2019, 3:22 pm

Seems like There is a lack of e interest in the entire community. It doesn’t even seem like game day is on a lot of people’s minds at businesses, hotel, restaurants etc. A lot of fans are probably watching the red school down the road on a year like this. winning does seem to cure a lot of problems. I would like to just see more of an energetic exciting environment in the stadium regardless of how many people

Go to Missoula, Montana on day when the FCS Grizzlies play and there is so much more hype and excitement than anything USU can muster. We're not even close. Most striking is how the business community get behind the Griz. In Logan, it is almost like the games are mostly tolerated and that is about it.

So what's driving the apathy from the businesses and a large part of the community in general? I don't know the history, was it always like this? If not, what changed?

Aggie19 wrote: ↑

December 13th, 2019, 9:43 am

NavyBlue wrote: ↑

December 13th, 2019, 8:55 am

Whatley_posse wrote: ↑

December 12th, 2019, 3:22 pm

Seems like There is a lack of e interest in the entire community. It doesn’t even seem like game day is on a lot of people’s minds at businesses, hotel, restaurants etc. A lot of fans are probably watching the red school down the road on a year like this. winning does seem to cure a lot of problems. I would like to just see more of an energetic exciting environment in the stadium regardless of how many people

Go to Missoula, Montana on day when the FCS Grizzlies play and there is so much more hype and excitement than anything USU can muster. We're not even close. Most striking is how the business community get behind the Griz. In Logan, it is almost like the games are mostly tolerated and that is about it.

So what's driving the apathy from the businesses and a large part of the community in general? I don't know the history, was it always like this? If not, what changed?

There is some history in Logan of a bit of a contentious relationship between the locals and the university. I won't attempt to defend or attack either position - it's not productive.
What I will say is that the university needs to make an effort to build relationships with the community. It would take a collective effort from the administration and the ADs office to establish and maintain that kind of relationship with the valley. I don't feel that effort is made in a transformative and sustaining way. I would say the only progress that's been made in my lifetime is to move it from somewhat contentious to generally apathetic - so I guess that's something.

I do not understand the Logan business community at all, it would benefit them in a big way if USU had real strong football, because if a 1,000 more folks traveled to Logan on game day cafe's hotels retail sales would all be helped. Hell if I had a cafe aggie stuff would be all over it. I have wondered if they do not want the extra business that would come, it almost seems lazy.

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

December 13th, 2019, 11:44 am

I do not understand the Logan business community at all, it would benefit them in a big way if USU had real strong football, because if a 1,000 more folks traveled to Logan on game day cafe's hotels retail sales would all be helped. Hell if I had a cafe aggie stuff would be all over it. I have wondered if they do not want the extra business that would come, it almost seems lazy.

I don't think it's just laziness. I believe in the past some Logan businesses displayed USU banners and stuff and USU came in and made them take it down because the business didn't have a contract with USU to do such things.

This might not be true, but I think I remember something like this. If there's any credence to it, gamefaqs probably remembers.

brownjeans wrote: ↑

December 13th, 2019, 3:51 pm

oleblu111 wrote: ↑

December 13th, 2019, 11:44 am

I do not understand the Logan business community at all, it would benefit them in a big way if USU had real strong football, because if a 1,000 more folks traveled to Logan on game day cafe's hotels retail sales would all be helped. Hell if I had a cafe aggie stuff would be all over it. I have wondered if they do not want the extra business that would come, it almost seems lazy.

I don't think it's just laziness. I believe in the past some Logan businesses displayed USU banners and stuff and USU came in and made them take it down because the business didn't have a contract with USU to do such things.

This might not be true, but I think I remember something like this. If there's any credence to it, gamefaqs probably remembers.

So where did the business get the banners ? I remember when we had a Village Inn they had kinds of aggie stuff their manger told me how thrilled the school was when they saw all they had done.

Sometimes I have heard bad things about what USU has done more than once I have found a lack of truth to what they say. I believe that if you buy a banner from USU I doubt they could stop you from displaying it in your place of business. I know several that have done that. You may need to do something if the school is giving you the items. Perhaps a misguided employee may have done some dumb thing in the past.